the podcast recap episode with aj & rory vaden

Ep 63: Putting A Stake Through The Sacred Cows of Your Industry with Mike Dillard | Recap Episode

Mike Dillard went from being an introverted direct sales worker to earning millions of dollars a year using smart marketing tactics and today we recap a few from our recent interview with him. He invented magnetic sponsoring which basically digitized marketing but more interestingly he convinced an initially disinterested audience that they needed his product. Key takeaways include Mike’s use of copywriting to create this market for his product, how he disrupted the field of marketing by taking it digital, and a potentially less tapped AdSpend strategy too. Make sure you catch this one and hear all about how Mike took his uniqueness and applied it with amazing success to his winning businesses.

Listen to the episode below:

Key takeaways from this episode:

  • The importance of writing good copy in building a personal brand.
  • Mike’s use of copywriting to manage being an introvert in direct sales.
  • The centrality of going against the grain for becoming remarkable/a thought leader.
  • Documentation and being remarkable: looking at how well-documented major events are.
  • An AdSpend strategy for splitting audience-building ads from conversion-producing ones.
  • Benefits of the Google/YouTube strategy over the Facebook/Instagram one.

Tweetable Moments:

“He became a millionaire – making millions of dollars every year – by learning how to write really amazing copy.” — @aj_vaden [0:02:55]

“We sometimes say, ‘Don’t promote the journey, promote the destination.’” — @roryvaden [0:03:24]

“What can you say that either forwards the thinking or sharpens the thinking or is somehow different from what has been said.” — @roryvaden [0:05:24]

“Do you have a new and better way and if so why not employ it?” — @aj_vaden [0:09:11]

About Mike Dillard

Mike is an expert when it comes to personal branding, product development, list-building, and creating sales presentations that convert cold traffic into paying customers at scale. His podcast provides entrepreneurs with the knowledge they need to fulfill their potential in every area of life. From business to investing, to health, and relationships, the podcast gives you the opportunity to learn from leaders like Tony Robbins, Daymond John, Tony Hawk, Mike Rowe, Gene Simmons, Peter Diamandis, Aubrey Marcus, Seth Godin, Simon Sinek, and more. To date, the podcast has received more than 5 million downloads and has been listed as one of the top 10 “must-listen” personal development podcasts in the world.

Links Mentioned:

RV: (00:00) Hey, welcome to the special recap edition of the influential personal brand podcast. Mike Dillard, a real life entrepreneur, network marketer, information marketer, doer of many, many things, investor, and really a breath of knowledge and wisdom to, to learn from. So we got our, our top three and three were both aligned in what our big takeaways were and we just want to summarize them and give you the, give you the highlights. So, babe, why don’t you AJV: (00:29) Yeah. My first one is really short and simple, but is the utter importance of copy. Knowing how to write it, knowing what to say, knowing how often to say it, knowing in what formats to say. I just think that hitting that was no doubt, an ongoing aha moments for anyone who is trying to build a personal brand. And I love the way that he put it. And he said, it’s, it’s your sale and writing. It’s the conversation you would have in writing. And I love how he talked about how he was an introvert and direct sales, very similar. He said, but he became a millionaire, right? Like making millions of dollars every year, not over many years, every year. Learning how to write really amazing copy because to some degree he was a little too shy to do it in person, which I thought was really fascinating. So he was forced to learn how to do it, but boy did he, he learned. RV: (01:24) Yeah, copywriting was the big thing for me. And you know, he used that illustration, which is been around for a while in direct marketing, which is you don’t sell the drill, you sell the hole, you sell the finish the finish product. We sometimes say, don’t sell the journey. Sell the destination. Right? No, she says it’s the climb. That’s totally different. That’s not what we’re talking about. Well then listening to Hannah Montana, well, I’m not saying that I haven’t been listening to Hannah Montana, but that’s not the lesson here. Is, is just, you know, sell, sell the white sand beaches and the, mai tais in this beautiful sunset, not the, Hey, we get up and we loved to the airport and we stuffed our suitcase and we paid baggage fees and we wait in line. And so you know how many modules it is and how many lessons now many courses, like that’s not what people are buying. They’re buying, they’re buying the result. AJV: (02:19) Financial freedom, security, flexibility RV: (02:23) Case, its reputation, it’s reach, its influence, its impact, its income. The fact that we put you through a nine phase process, this with detailed exercises and tons of education, you’ve got to learn. It’s like that’s, that’s the hardware. So don’t, don’t sell that car. Don’t tell him that part. Tell him, tell him what the results. AJV: (02:41) Yeah, but I just, I, I just know for us at brand builders groups, so many of our clients really struggle with how to write copy. What should I be saying? Just even getting the process started and it’s one of the one probably singular main reasons outside of design that we even started our brands implementation services that we do for our clients is it’s, it’s a real challenge for people to learn how to write. Sales copy is a challenge. So that was my big first takeaway. Yeah. RV: (03:08) Marketing copy copy. Copy. Copy. All right. The second one for both of us was, it’s funny cause the AJ is a big believer in this about where does thought leadership come from and well against the grain is that a lot of, a lot of times you know it’s like, you know, if, if to be remarkable as Seth Godin says, is, is being worth re worth being remarked about than what is remarkable. It’s the things that you don’t often hear it either in a captivated content in that whole event and area we talk about what can you say that either forwards the thinking or is sharpens the thinking or is somehow different from what has been said. And Mike was a great example of that. I mean it sounds like he was disrupting, you know, early on he was disrupting the industry that he was in in terms of network marketing. He was one of the early people to go, Hey, you can do this digitally and that positions you as a thought leader that that makes you outstanding. It makes you remarkable is what can I say that’s, you know, counterintuitive or different or unique or advancing somehow what’s been done or what’s been said? AJV: (04:23) No. Yeah, and I, I think for me, I think you’ve probably heard this for years, the whole concept of look around, see what everyone else is doing and then do the opposite. Like we probably hear that. I don’t think many people let it sink in and then actually do it because it’s so easy to look around and see what everyone else is doing and be like, Oh, I gotta do that. I had to do that too. Everyone has a course. I need a course. Everyone has email marketing. I need to do that. Everyone’s on Instagram, I need to be on Instagram. And all of a sudden you look around and it’s like you’re doing all this stuff and none of it is really true to you. Yeah. Because you did it just because other ones were. And he really said that, you know, he took a look inside and said, I wanted to see what everyone else was doing and then just be like, but you don’t have to, it doesn’t have to be that way. And he found ways of really doing what worked for him and his own uniqueness and then made it really apply to the business. And you know, it’s interesting cause Roy and I were even been watching the series with Andy Stanley who is one of our favorite pastors of all time in Atlanta. And Buckhead church is the church, if you ever want a two nets RV: (05:27) Bible for grownups is the name is the name of this. AJV: (05:29) Yeah. And I just, I think this is an amazing parallel as one of the things that Andy Stanley was talking about. He said the Bible itself is only in existence because something outstanding happened that was noteworthy, right? The, the Bible is not this chronological documentation of everything that happened. That’s not, that’s not what the Bible is. The Bible is a collection of personal letters and proof that was passed down from person to person for years and years documenting and outstanding event that happened. Not all that different than how we would document something today. Right? There is no doubt that the Corona virus, which is very prevalent and all of 2020 I will be documented in a variety of different ways. When I think about this all the time when Sully landed on the Hudson, it was documented in a way because it was something that was unique and outstanding and noteworthy. And I just, I liken that to this RV: (06:31) Being remarkable, doing something remarkable. And you know what Andy was saying is if just if Jesus died, there’d be nothing to write about that happened, but that people saw him in the resurrection and all that. You know, whether you believe that or not isn’t necessarily the point right here, but it’s going. So many people saw him. It was something that happened. So many people wrote about it and that later became a collection of documents. But it’s like something big happens and it’s outside of the ordinary and that’s part of how you break through is like it’s, it’s, again, I think it’s in our context, it’s about what are you doing that is unique to you and how is your message, how does it separate itself from the crowd? How does it stand out? What is unique about it in one easy place to say is, can I be counterintuitive? That’s one place to look. In addition to, into some others. AJV: (07:27) Well, I think too, just on that, and I’ll make this really short, it’s, it’s truly looking at does it have to be the way that it is, right? If this doesn’t feel right to me, if this isn’t the way that I like to do things, it isn’t easy for me. Do you have a new and better way? And if so, why not employ it? You know, why not teach it? Why not instruct it? Which is exactly what he did. RV: (07:50) Yeah. So the critical, the critical thinking of not just accepting what is. Yeah, I like that. So then the other part I think was ads was talking about how do you do the ad spend and you know, running, running ads and that was a big part of the conversation. And the thing that was edifying for me to hear because this is, you know, Mike and I have met a couple times, but this was the first time that we’re really like we’re talking shop in detail was the way that he was talking about one of the strategies that we teach at phase three, which is when you get into paid ads, everybody thinks about just like buying an a lead for an ad that will convert. And really you almost, you want to almost separate that in, split that into and say, I want to buy an ad that helps me build an audience that helps me build trust that that first I know this is someone who’s interested in my content because they’ve looked, they’ve watched, they’ve liked, they’ve commented, they have engaged and then I will serve up the ads or the things that convert those people only to those people rather just walking up. RV: (08:56) You know, the, the equivalent would be selling to a stranger. And so going, no, I’m gonna use, there’s a two part two pieces here to how we use paid ads, build the audience, build a trust first with no real call to action other than engage with my content and then come behind it and create the conversion. And you know, that’s, that’s how you lower the ad costs and you know, spend less money and have more results. AJV: (09:20) Yeah. And also not look completely salesy to the external world cause that’s all you’re doing is your reputation. Cause I feel like that’s a huge concern that a lot of our network has as well. I don’t want to look like that person. And that’s just a strategy behind it. I also loved on this and we were somewhat aligned when this, and you know, you hear so many people talking about Instagram and Facebook, but I, I have heard this more and more over the last few months and I don’t know what it is. Maybe you have insight. I don’t. But Mike brought it up again and he said, yeah, well we’ve been doing the Facebook, Instagram thing, but our focus is shifting towards a Google and YouTube. And I know that we’ve learned some really cool things from our ad partner lie and spa about some unique YouTube strategy. So you want to share some of those? RV: (10:04) Well, yeah. Well, and also we have, we have an interview coming out with Rick steel here in a couple of weeks. That is freaking mind blowing around Google and, and paid ads. But yeah, I mean there’s a lot of cool things you can do on YouTube as an example, one of the things that we didn’t really know is that you can run an ad on a specific video, even if it isn’t your video. So like my Ted talk that has millions of views, we’ve never run an ad on that video, which is dumb. There’s millions of people who are literally watching me that we never have a way to connect with. And knowing that we can run an ad on that video, even if it’s not our video, is a game changer. AJV: (10:44) Or even at running ads on our own videos. RV: (10:46) Yeah. To our own stuff. Just to say someone, just somebody sitting here watching this video right now to introduce them to some things go and say, Hey, how can we, how can we move them off of this video into one of the funnels? Because you can target so specifically down to each individual AJV: (11:04) And YouTube advertising right now is so much less expensive. Yes. The wild, wild West. I just think those were just really interesting things that we keep hearing and popping up. And he brought that up. He also shares tons of really interesting investing ideas and he, as we were, he said is it’s a wealth of knowledge and there’s a lot of different things covered on this interview, so, well worth checking out, RV: (11:27) Check it out. But you know, look, there’s a sign to this. There’s a, there’s a structure and you hear people like Mike who clearly has been a student of the game for years and years and years. He’s learning, he’s getting coaching, he is reading and then he’s testing and he’s executing and he’s experimenting. He’s trying it out. And it adds up over the course of time. So we’re glad that you’re here. We feel lucky to be a part of your personal development and business development journey specifically around helping you build and monetize your personal brand. We’ll catch you next time on the influential personal brand.

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