Ep 355: The Four Non-Negotiables for Successful Virtual Events | Bari Baumgardner Episode Recap
RV (00:02):
So Tony Robbins is arguably the, at least one of the most successful personal brands in the world, one of the biggest personal brands in the world one of the, the highest revenue generating personal brands in the world. I mean, you know, he’d, he’d be up there, Dave Ramsey, Tony Robbins, you know,
RV (01:12):
And probably when people needed encouragement and inspiration the most, they found a way to do this and make it profitable and a great experience for everybody. And we got a chance to talk to her. And I have to say, I had, I, I had never talked to Bari. Very rarely do we have someone on this show where it’s like I’m meeting them for the first time during the interview. But that was the case here with Barry. She was referred to me by a good friend of mine, Randy Garn, and, and I, I’d heard about Bari and Blue because you know, we’ve used their technology, et cetera. And anyways, it was such an awesome interview, a powerful interview here on running profitable virtual events. I think we’re gonna try this. I think we’re actually gonna experiment with this format. So anyways, let me give you the, my three highlights and takeaways.
RV (02:01):
In some ways, this one really, this one more than other episodes, really will function as like a summary of what she covered, because she covered so much, and it was, it was so powerful that even, even for my own knowledge and like my own retention, I’m, you know, some of this, I’m just recapping. So first of all, she talked about the four non-negotiables of a virtual event. And the big idea here, which is so simple, but so smart and powerful, is to go, if you want a virtual event to emulate the kind of results that you would have from a physical in-person event, then you need to try to emulate the in-person event experience or, or the dynamics of it as much as possible. And that makes so much sense to me. And she said well, there’s four non-negotiables that we have. So first is the registration process has to take place.
RV (02:56):
You have to go through a virtual check-in process that makes sense. Second was physical swag and sending somebody something physically in the mail. And that makes a lot of sense, right? That’s like super powerful that makes people show up and take it, take it serious. The third was gamification which I think is more of just like a attention, it’s like attention or retention strategy. And then the fourth is interactivity, which of course is the best part of in-person events, is almost, it’s almost always the people you meet and, and you know, the, the relationships you make in the hallways and all that kind of stuff. And it’s, it’s not just what you’re learning, but the people that are there. Well, in a virtual environment, you have to really work just deliberately to recreate that. And so those are four simple things, you know, she walked through them in detail, but I think it’s more of just, you know, there’s lots of ways for how to do those four things.
RV (03:52):
It’s more of knowing what the four things are. And, and, and really to me, the big idea there is going, how can we model our virtual event to emulate the experiences of an in-person event? And by doing that, we’ll emulate the results of an in-person event that will, will emulate the, the experience, the client experience, the user experience of being at a real event in person. And that’s what they’re doing. And that’s part of why they’re getting the kind of same sales results and bigger sales results with these virtual events. We’ll talk about that in just a second. The second big takeaway, which to me was like, I guess the grand takeaway of the whole interview was this very, very simple three day format. And on the one hand, I’m like a little bit skeptical of going, can you really hold people’s attention for three days?
RV (04:47):
But on the other hand, I mean brand builders group, we do two day events, like all of our members the people, our, our our paying members who are in our coaching program, they get unlimited access to our events. So part of what they do is they pay a monthly fee and they can come to, we do an event, we do a two day event every single month, and they can come as many to as many as they want. It’s unlimited access, and the time flies by. So I go, yeah, I, I could totally see the three day format. But the key is, and she made this point, which is also how we’ve constructed our events, is you’re not teaching for three straight days. Like, you can’t just stand up and talk for three days. And certainly not in a virtual event. So the whole thing is it’s gotta be interactive.
RV (05:33):
There’s gotta be exercises and questions and dialogues. And and this is one of the reasons why I think we might try this, is because when somebody comes to one of our events, their life is freaking changed. I mean, when our members, this is why we retain our clients for years. Like on average, our clients stay with us for years. Like we’ve only been in business for four years, and like a third of the clients that signed up with us in the very beginning are still with us, are like more like 25%, 25% of the people who signed up with us like four years ago are still with us. So people hang around and then we didn’t even know what we were doing back then, right? So we’re just figuring it out, like you’ve really gotten it dialed in in the last couple years.
RV (06:17):
And but people, when they have this experience, it’s like life changing and, and then they stick around. And so part of what our team has been trying to figure out is going, how do we get people to sort of get that experience, like get a way to sample that? And I think Barry’s model here is a great one. And so we’re, we’re looking at this. We’re not, haven’t officially announced that we’re gonna do this, but I’m, you know, again, I’m learning right alongside you here with the people who come on this show. And this is one that was, was super compelling to me going, I think we, we should try this because we have a lot of fans that have not yet become customers. And it’s like, it’s like, I think they trust us. I think they kind of see it, but it’s exactly what she was talking about.
RV (07:04):
They’re not totally sure that they could do it or what the next step is, or that it’s worth the money or that. And so it’s sort of like they just need to experience it. And I think this three day format gives people a chance to really experience it and get involved and, and get acclimated and, and, and get familiar with your content and, and what the process feels like to go through. So, you know, she talked about this three day format and you know, the, basically the, the first day is just getting a sense of what is possible teaching some content, like, you know, adding some real value in the first day. And, and probably it’s, I got the sense that like a lot, a lot of the teaching does happen in the first day or, or a big part of the first day is teaching and, and giving people real content but also giving them a chance to sort of establish their own vision and, and, and see what do they see as possible for themself.
RV (08:00):
And then day two is really where you spend more time talking about the gap of, of like, okay, where, where are you now compared to where you wanna be? And what would your life look like if you achieve that? And what’s the process that it takes to get there? And and so you, you sort of, and then you show them the solution and you show them the journey. So like, for example, at Brand Builders Group, we have our brand builder journey. Ours is actually called the Brand Builder journey. In fact, if you’ve never been to our website, if you go to brand builders group.com and then under the about menu, there’s a sub menu. That’s our brand process. You can see how we, we map this out for people just as an example. And, and also if you, if you haven’t yet requested a call with our team, you should go look at this and, and it’ll, it lays out, you know, our 12 like, well, we have a 14 part journey all in that we take people on to go from like concept all the way to eight figure personal brand and becoming one of the most well known people in the world, which several of our clients are.
RV (09:09):
So you can, you can check that out at, just go to brand builders group.com and click on about, and then click on our brand process. But I think that’s what I got a sense is whatever your brand process is, that’s what you lay out on day two. Those of you that are listening that are members of ours, when we, what this would be is when we take you through captivating content and we help you map out all your pillars and you lay out like your high level framework and you, you know, your unique branded methodology and all those, those things, that’s what you’re really introducing them to in day two is what it sounds like. And then tactically, this was important. I was digging, you know, to make sure I got crystal clear on this, at the end of day two is where you make the offer, right?
RV (09:52):
So that’s where you make the offer and you let people sort of hear it and you invite them to join. And and so you think of day two as making the offer. And then day three is basically like closed cart. And so then on day three, they come back. Day three is all about just getting people that are there to make a decision to do something differently in their life, to future cast or to vision what it’s gonna feel like when they do reach the goals that they have and reminding people it’s not too late to join. And then there, it, it sounds like there’s a second offer on day three in the morning, which is the heart you know, the heart pitch and the heart close in the morning. And then I, I thought it was really great where Barry was talking about you need to have celebration.
RV (10:42):
And you know, there, there were a couple, couple key things here. One was having that lunchtime celebration for all, all new members or all people who were joining, whatever the program is that they get to come. And so, you know, like she said, no one wants to miss the start of a program. And so people wanna sign up cuz they want to get to get that invitation that’s really compelling and powerful and, and, and productive. Like pragmatic could go while you’re all here, let’s get everyone together and like actually start the program and, and, and get people going. Really, really smart and simple. And then the other thing that I really loved was where she was saying you know, have breakout rooms in your virtual meeting for sales to take place, right? And I think she said, you know, something like with Tony, they’ve got, you know, dozens of salespeople just standing by running breakout rooms. And so when people have questions, they’re just going, oh, hey, you come over, you know, come in here and talk with our salesperson. You don’t say salesperson, but like, come get your questions answered. That’s super productive. And you know, just really smart. And like, again,
RV (11:52):
She’s emulating what happens in a real life event, at a real life event. You know, you make an offer, people go to the back table to talk to someone to get information about it, and then they sign up. Well, in a virtual room, you got in a virtual event, you gotta create the same thing. So the way you do that is you leverage breakout rooms in Zoom and and if you don’t have a sales team, then you could use like a Coly link and, and let people schedule times with you, you know, that evening or, you know, sometime very, or or in near and in and around the event so that you can close people and, and sign ’em up while they’re excited. And that just, gosh, I mean, that makes so much sense to me. So simple. And, and like she said, the best part about it is the, the, you don’t have to do like a big hard sales pitch.
RV (12:35):
The the format of the event sells itself because people are with you long enough to trust you. You know, if they’re gonna stay that long, like if they don’t, they’re gonna bail, right? So they’re, they’re, they’re gonna stay there. They, they’re long enough to trust you, to feel part of the community and meet people and to really have a true immersive experience, a chance to experience what it feels like to be one of your customers. And you know, I look at Tony Robbins and go, oh, like all of Tony’s events are three and four days and all of these other events I’ve been to where they make high ticket offer, they’re all like three and four days. I mean funnel Hacking Live is that way. And I mean all of Tony’s events, relationship mastery and, you know or Business Mastery and then I think, yeah, date With Destiny and all these, they’re, they’re multi-day events.
RV (13:22):
And you go, yeah, because after someone’s had that experience, they’re like really bought in. And I just love it. So you kind of let the, the format of the event just do its thing, make it, give you lots of time for q and a and, and exercises and dialogue and, you know, networking and meeting. That’s really, really cool. I really love it. And so the third, my third big takeaway there is just the numbers of how this works. And we have another client that’s doing this right now who, who is generating several hundred thousands of dollars, like a few hundred thousand dollars from each one of these events. And they’ll get like a few hundred people there, maybe 300 to 500 people will show up. And so they’re, they’re selling the tickets for a low ticket price, like 97 or, or 1 97.
RV (14:07):
And historically our events at Brand Builders group are $3,000 each. Cuz they’re, I mean, our events are legit. I mean, they are, they’re like more powerful than a college course, but not everyone has that kind of money. And so, you know, I’m going, golly, if we lowered the price on one of these, just a, just a first one where people got a chance to sample it, I wonder if we can move some of those. I bet we could, I bet we could move a ton of ’em. So you, you go, you have a 97 to 1 97, and again, here’s what’s really cool about is, is it’s a virtual event. So you’re not paying for venue rental and for AV and for food and beverage and printing workbooks and like name tags and like having your staff there and coffee and like parking and all the, the massive number of expenses that add up for a, for an in-person event.
RV (14:56):
So you go, I can charge a lower price and I can impact more people. Like, that’s the best part of this is like money aside, just going, man, I can impact more people, impact people all over the globe by doing a virtual event. And, and that’s why you’re doing this, right? I mean, that’s why you’re a mission driven messenger. You’re going, I I want to help people. So, you know, the price is obviously a barrier to the, to the number of people you get to help. And so lowering that price is, is, you know, an interesting idea because you, you can actually do it and you at least break even maybe for your time or you know, the cost of a small team to help you put on the event, et cetera. But anyways, you, you charge, you know, somewhere between 97 to $197 it sounds like.
RV (15:40):
And you know, she said, did you hear this? She said, we’re making offers that go up to $500,000. So at the end of three days, they’re making offers at some of these events that are as much as a half a million dollars for a customer. So that’s pretty crazy just to wrap your mind around. But a $5,000 offer, you know, 3000, 5,000, $10,000, like this is happening regularly. And I think that’s really interesting. So now one thing she did say is numbers wise that in an in-person event, a solid average is like closing 20% of the room, which to me is high. That feels higher than what, what is normal, but let’s say it’s 20%. And then she said in a virtual event, it’s more like 10 to 15%. So it’s slightly lower in my mind. I’m going, okay, call that, you know, 10 to 15% in a live event and five to 10% in a virtual, but the difference is it’s five to 10%.
RV (16:41):
So it’s a lower percentage, but it’s a smaller percentage of a much bigger number because there’s a whole bunch more people there because the ticket price is lower and it’s a virtual event, so you don’t have all the cost of the venue and all that stuff. So it changes the dynamics of this completely, which is really amazing. And, and she said, you know, imagine if you’re just getting started and you, you know, you get 50 people to show up to this thing and you get five people to buy a $5,000 offer, it’s 25 grand. Like for me, when I was first starting, like that was a been big time money, right? Like that’s, yeah, $25,000 is good money. Like for anybody, like, unless you’re Elon Musk, most of us aren’t stepping over $25,000 bills
RV (17:25):
I mean, this was just fascinating, like having her spell out the whole model and go behind the scenes, really, really interesting. And, and it also was powerful that she’s going, it’s not the technology, she sells the technology to help you do it, but she’s just using Zoom, so her technology layers on top of Zoom to make it a little more like customizable and, and gamified and all that stuff. But she’s saying, you know, you can do this, this with Zoom. It’s, it’s not, the technology’s not the magic. The format is the magic. And I can see that, and I, I I love that. So, and again, you know, at the end of the day, the big idea here is you’re impacting lives. That’s it. You’re changing lives. You’re going go in virtual events, give us the opportunity to impact lives at scale. Everything virtually gives us the opportunity, the blessing, the privilege to impact lives at scale.
RV (18:21):
And we can afford to charge lower prices for these in-person events or excuse me, for the virtual events because it doesn’t cost the, the same and you can get people to, to, to show up and and then you can sell more people if it’s a feeder event. Now she’s saying for your real events charge the same price as you normally would because it’s the same amount of time. And the, the value, the content is the same whether it’s in person or not. But for these, for these entry level events to like fill your programs and try to try to use a three day event to fill the program, I’m, I’m excited about it and I’m on board. If nothing else, it’s an experiment. I think we’re gonna have to try just to see if we can reach more people, reach you.
RV (19:04):
Some of you probably are listening are not yet customers of ours and you’ve never had a chance to experience like the Brand Builders group experience. So I don’t know, maybe we’ll have Barry Baumgartner to thank thank for that. So anyways, figure out ways to impact lives. Can you do it virtually? Reach more people, be able to make the money you need, but by charging a lot you know, more people, a lower dollar amount. That’s inspiring to me. You’re inspiring to me. Helping you get your message out to more people is inspiring to me. So I hope you’ll keep coming back, share this episode with somebody that you think will enjoy it. Tell ’em about the influential personal brand podcast or at least go rate us on iTunes, leave a review, and we’re so grateful to have you. Hopefully you’re following me on Instagram, come over and say hi or on LinkedIn. And that’s it for this time. We’ll catch you next time on the Influential Personal Brand podcast.
Ep 354: Running Profitable Virtual Events with Bari Baumgardner
RV (00:02):
Well, if you are a mission driven messenger, that’s probably why you’re listening to the show. And if that is you, you had your life interrupted in a big way by covid, as did everyone. But specifically those of us that are speakers, coaches, authors, experts, personal brands of events and speaking at events and hosting events has been a really big part of is what we do. And when Covid hit, the whole world of events changed. And one of the companies that was quick to jump to the front of the line in terms of their thought leadership, the event production going virtual is an event called, or is a, is a company called Sage Event Management. And you’re about to meet Bari Baumgartner, she’s the founder of the company, she’s the chief strategist. She runs it with her husband Blue, who handles some more of the technology and sort of creative sides.
RV (00:56):
But when I tell you that these two and their company went to the forefront of the industry, it happened virtually overnight. Part of it was Tony Robbins was one of their, their big clients where they helped to put on this massive live virtual event he has has unleashed the power within U P W and they’re the team that helped Tony take that event Virtual which has become a smashing success. It’s affected thousands and thousands of people. They’ve also worked with Dean Graziosi, Jeff Walker Jamie Kern Lima, another good friend of ours, Eric Wary, Pete Vargas. Amy Porterfield, another brand builders group client of ours. So they’ve worked with a lot of our friends, a lot of our clients they have a really key technology piece that a lot of people are using, but it’s more of just understanding the strategy of how to produce high dollar offer virtual events and how to use virtual events to to grow your platform and your business. So anyways, Barry is here with me in person. Barry, I’m so glad to meet you. Thanks for making time for us.
BB (02:01):
Absolutely Rory, thank you for having me. I’m excited to be here.
RV (02:04):
So what exactly do you do? Okay, so I kind of give that like a background, but like tell us, how would you de describe what you, what you guys do at Sage?
BB (02:15):
Yeah, thank you for asking. I think what’s really interesting about what we do that’s different from a lot of event production companies out there as we lead with strategy first. So our company Sage actually stands for strategic advice for growing events. And from our very first day opening our doors, gosh it’s hard to believe it was 18 years ago out of a guest bedroom in my house, I opened Sage Event Management. And the concept was what’s the strategy behind the event? And you know, I think it’s interesting an event world, so much of it is checklisting, right? Like you have to checklist a little bit to get it done. Yeah. And I often think, and I don’t mean any disrespect to event planners who do it this way, but a lot of times it’s almost like a glorified waitress, a glorified order taker. It’s like, yes ma’am, yes sir, let’s make it happen.
BB (03:00):
You know, it’s an expectations plus kind of industry. But so often I find that people don’t ask why are we doing it? So, you know, if you come to Sage, the first question we’re gonna ask you is, what’s your big why? Like, what are you out there to do to change the world? What does it mean to you personally to do it? Who are you meant to serve? What are your non-negotiables and how do you make that right? Fit client rave, renew and recruit. It’s at the heart of everything we do. And then we design your live event and then we design the logistics to support the live event. So that strategy first approach, I think is what differentiated us from the beginning and led to us working with some of the biggest names in the personal development and business development space. Mm-Hmm.
RV (03:38):
BB (04:40):
Yeah, absolutely. Well first of all, I think that Covid did for the events industry, what nine 11 did to the travel industry, it changed it forever. You know, after nine 11 travel never looked the same. And after Covid, I think events are never gonna look the same. It ushered in a whole new way of communicating with our audiences. And what was interesting, listen, for 15 years we’ve done in-person events and I think of them specifically as enrollment events. Our events always have a high ticket offer. So speakers, authors, coaches who are selling a one to many group coaching program or mastermind. That’s what I think of as a high ticket offer. And so we’re reverse engineering the event around that high ticket offer.
RV (05:16):
Say that again. What did just go, sorry, but rewind there quick. You said it’s a mastermind or a a one to one or a group coaching program? Yeah,
BB (05:24):
It could be one to one like, you know, VIP days or a done for you service. It could be a one to many like a group coaching program or a mastermind. Any of those things could be part of what you’re doing. But when I think of a high ticket offer, I’m generally thinking of an offer that’s 5,000 and above one that would take an audience more than a minute to think about more than, you know, something you might sell on a webinar or a challenge or a launch. You know those well for some audiences I think it’s still a big investment. When you start thinking of a high ticket offer, it’s one that might give you pause. Like that’s a big investment, how am I gonna pay for that? And the, the three day model, the three day event model calibrated properly, this is the framework we’re talking about actually will lead your audience to say this is amazing, I want more.
BB (06:06):
And you’re like, I thought you would, I have something for you. And that’s your high ticket offer. So when you get to that 80% role you were talking about what’s awesome about what we learned from Covid and doing virtual events is that in-person events and virtual events are 80% the same. The framework that we’ve always taught that we use for the biggest names in the business and for people you’ve never heard of is 80% the same, the 20% that’s different between in-person and virtual is what we call tech and touch. The technology is different and the touch points are different, but the good news is the framework for making a high ticket offer is the same. And why that’s good for you is if you wanna do in person or you wanna do virtual, you wanna do both. You’re not sure. It doesn’t matter if you learn the framework, you can easily pivot between the two.
RV (06:51):
Okay. So, so talk to me about the three day event strategy. Cause I know this is like big part of what you guys do and then sort of like, like you’re saying, it’s, it sounds like you were doing this long before, you’ve been doing this for years and years Covid happened, you were one of the first ones to go virtual. You guys did it with Tony, it was the smashing success. And then like all of a sudden you guys blew up and now you’re like everywhere you broke through the wall, as we say it’s like you broke through the wall. But it’s, if, if I, from what I gather sort of your bread and butter is like if you’re gonna make a high ticket offer, you do that over a three day event. So can you just like walk us through what happens over these three days? How long is it, where is it? Like all all that? I mean clearly you’re talking about that we could actually do this virtually.
BB (07:35):
Yes. Yeah. And I really do think that COVID ushered in this virtual opportunity. I think of it as the democratization of live events. Meaning that you don’t have to have a big list, you don’t have to have a big studio, you don’t have to big budget, you don’t have to have a big production. You can do this with a computer, a TV, and a Zoom account. We’ll come back to that in just a minute. Okay. So it’s that simple. So this is what’s really amazing about virtual, but the three day framework that we’ve become known for is based on the fact that there are two types of buyers for high ticket offer. A logical buyer and an emotional buyer. An emotional buyer when they hear an offer is like, sounds great. I meant where do I sign up? That’s my husband blue. Like he’s never met an offer he doesn’t like. Like if you’re that kinda buyer, then you’re an emotional buyer.
RV (08:20):
What’s driving down the street? Saw banners had had free hot dogs, walked home with a brand new Lexus, like for
BB (08:25):
Sure, for sure. Or we have like the toothpaste subscription, the sock subscription, the underwear,
BB (09:09):
Meaning that it’s harder to write a short letter than a long letter. Is it harder to give a TED talk or a workshop? Yep. A TED talk, right? Every word has to be perfect. So why I love a three day event, especially for people who are up and coming and wanna make a high ticket offer, is that it, it’s really flexible and it’s very forgiving. Meaning that if you don’t get your offer perfect in a three day, you have a lot of time for recovery and repositioning, which is especially important for those logical buyers. When you do a one day everything better, be perfect for that high ticket offer or you’re not gonna get the sales you want. So I’ve devoted our business and my life to teaching people this three day model and this framework that actually takes the, the buyer, the potential buyer through a process of, I think of this as buyer’s psychology, what you can do that, oh wait a minute, I could do that.
BB (09:58):
Oh wait, now that I hear how you do this, I will do that. And then when you make your offer, you’re like, oh, I must do that. And when you hear the repitch on the last day, you’re like, I am crazy not to do that. So I think our journey as a host, as an event host who’s making a high ticket offer is to take them from you can do that. To wait, I could do that to, I will do that, I must do that. I’m crazy not to do that. And a logical buyer needs that time. An emotional buyer is like, what you can do that I could do that I’m in, where do I sign up? But the logical buyer needs time to actually process it and think through it. And the three day model gives you the opportunity to do that, whether you’re doing it in person or virtually doesn’t matter.
RV (10:34):
Yeah. And one of the things that you said we were chatting a little bit before is that you know, we were talking about like some of the events like Ed, for Ed Millet’s book launch. Many listeners are familiar. We did a whole bunch of stuff with Ed’s launch. One of the things was a live event. We were using your technology to run the Zoom rooms. So we host Yeah, it was awesome. I mean like, like it was, it was great. We, we, we hosted the event at Steven Scoggins place. He’s a client of ours, he’s one of our strategists. We love the guy. He’s the one who was like, you know, that was one of the first times I heard Barry and Blue Barry and Blue Barry and Blue
BB (11:46):
It is. And here’s what’s amazing about this. So when, when Covid first hit, this was like March 15th, 2020 and Trump was forced to shut the country down and we were actually at an event in Miami and just a quick, quick story. We were flying in from a strategy day in Puerto Rico with Stu McLaren actually to a, to this event in Miami. And you know, we’re a million miles. I mean it’s a dubious honor. You fly a lot, you get upgraded a lot cuz you’re flying all the time. And we almost always get upgraded to first class and we’re flying into Miami and we didn’t get upgraded And I’m like, you know, I turn to my husband blue, I’m like, this is not really a thing. This whole covid thing is so hyped up when the airport’s this busy, the flights are this busy. Like it’s just, I think it’s just a bunch of media hype while we’re at this event in Miami, the country shuts down and literally as we’re flying home on an empty flight, we were in first class on this, we’re the only people in first class.
BB (12:37):
It was like a zombie airport, you know, we’re flying home. I’m like, okay, now it’s a thing. Now we have a problem. And literally we went from, well we were, I remember being in Puerto Rico and having clients call going, should we be worried about our event? I’m like, no it’s fine. It’s not a thing to literally that week people calling and like postpone, cancel, postpone, cancel, postpone, cancel. And if you’re the kind of business we are, we have a lot of repeat business. Somebody postponing to the next year or saying, I’m gonna cancel this year and we’ll revisit this when this thing blows over is lost money. Like you’re not, we were expecting you to do this again next year. Right? So the fact that you’re postponing, you know, where where are we replacing the money from this year? And we had this choice of either going down to being a consultancy and letting our team go, which I really did not wanna do cuz we have an amazing team or rethinking it.
BB (13:23):
And this is like the quick pivot. Within two weeks we went from to our first client, which actually was not Tony, it was a guy named Dylan Frost. I’ll forever be grateful to Dylan Frost of Amazon Wholesale Formula. We went to him and said, Hey, your event was supposed to be the first week of April in person. We’ve tried live streams and broadcasts and some will cast before they’ve never worked not with high ticket offers. There’s never a good conversion on them cuz they’re very passive. I want you to think about this with me as we’re thinking about what’s different and in person and virtual, they’re very passive ex viewing experiences. We’re broadcasting at you, we’re not talking with you. Sure. And we said, but we have an idea for this event being interactive and being virtual and it may be a total disaster. And to give credit where credits due, my husband Blue came up with this idea.
BB (14:06):
He literally said, what if we were to put a bunch of TVs together and link them all together in a way that we could see all these different Zoom galleries, have people come to different rooms so that we can see all of their faces and we can chat with all of them so that it’s an interactive experience. It’s not just that we’re broadcasting at them, we’re actually able to spotlight them and take q and a and interact with them and see their chats. And so again, when you ask what makes us different, I think because of the kind of company we are, immediately what we did different from any other tech platform was rather than focus on the audience experience, we focused on the host experience. What we know to be true is if the host isn’t getting that real time interaction, if they’re not feeling it, the event’s gonna be a flop.
BB (14:49):
So when we went to Dylan, we said we have an idea, let’s partner on this. We’ve got two weeks to put it together. Let’s just float it out there and see what happens. Now this event in person for three years had been about 300 people domestic US. And when we launched the idea of an international, like anybody come one come all you can sign up for this virtual event. It’s gonna be interactive and experiential. We went from a solid 300 over the last three years to 1200 and less than a week. And for the first, and it was free. Was it free? It was paid. It was paid. No, that was one of our rules paid like a webinar is free, a challenge is free, an event’s not free. And this goes back to tech and touch. So thank you for asking me that. Immediately what we did were four non-negotiables that we’ve stuck with since because they’ve worked so well.
BB (15:35):
If you’re going and this is where tech and touch the 20%, that’s different. Think about an amazing in-person experience that you’ve had at an event. You never start an event without registration, right? You have to get credentialed, you have to go to registration and pick up your badge. So one of the first things we did with virtual is say you have to go to registration and pick up your credentials. So we did a virtual check-in experience and that made sure that they would show up the morning of day one knowing what to do. Like you don’t wanna start an in person or a virtual experience. People going, where do I go and where do I click and how does this work again? So by having a check-in experience, just like you would from person just virtualized we did it by Zoom. We literally had live people on Zoom checking people in making sure they knew how to use our tech platform, Avio, which we created virtually overnight.
BB (16:24):
And making sure that they were set up for success so that we started on time on day one with no tech fails. That was point number one of the 20%. That’s different. The other thing that we did is we sent swag, physical swag to every single person who registered even if it had to be overnighted. And the reason for that is we wanted to differentiate ourselves from a webinar. You know, how many webinars do you like? I’m gonna sign up for this, it’s free. I might go, I’ll catch the replay. You’re not really super serious about it. Which is why they generally have a 30% show up rate. But if an event had a 30% show up rate, that’s a disaster. So we made a, we had this idea, what if you got physical swag, someone knocks on the door and literally hands you a box or an envelope with swag in it.
BB (17:08):
You’re like wow, well this is a different kind of event. This is definitely not a three day zoom meeting. This is definitely not a webinar. What, what’s in here? Oh my gosh. Like a journal and a workbook and some stickers and some emoji paddles so that I can you know, interact with you from afar and you can see my interaction and my emotion from afar when you’re on stage. Not only did they get more excited about the event, there was some recipro of frost in that. So they did better at showing up for the event and they were more likely to remember that it was different than a zoom. You know, when you said how long could the meeting be? We were toying around with that on the first one. Like will they stay with us for eight full hours? Right? And what we found was the third point that’s critical on the difference in tech and touch, which is some form of gamification.
BB (17:51):
There has to be some form of interaction with them in the form of breakouts, giving them points for showing up points for taking action. And that’s where Avio comes in. The dashboard that we created allowed them to have a wrapper on Zoom. So they’re all using Zoom technology. There’s 350 million people on Zoom at any one moment in time. Like that’s not user accounts, it’s 350 million people using Zoom at this moment in time. Wow. So people know Zoom and I think that was something else people were getting wrong in the conversion to virtual. There were all these fancy solutions, but it was like make a fake avatar and knock on a fake door, go into it, it was a little too techy and people would be turned off by what do I have to learn in order to attend this event? Right? Everybody knows Zoom. I mean grandparents know it, kids know it, everybody in between.
BB (18:35):
So it was an easy solution but we had to put a rapper on it that allowed people to have interaction, to be able to download resources, to be able to take action and for us to reward that action through leaderboard and gifts and all kinds of interactions so that they would stay with us for three full days. And what we found was 90% showed up consistently event over event. And of that 90% they would stay with us for three full days. And here’s what I really love about virtual. Stay with us for three full days. You remember in person events where at the end of the, I
RV (19:08):
Gotta go early to go to catch a flight. Yep. To get home in time for dinner.
BB (19:11):
You got it. They don’t have to the virtual.
RV (19:14):
So what was the fourth
BB (19:15):
One? Yeah, the fourth one is that there has to be I think some form of interactivity, like that breakout piece that I mentioned is really critical. Like I really think they need interactivity where they’re being do you know in in-person events where it’s like turn to the person next to you or you’re meeting in the coffee shop or maybe you’re chatting in the ballroom waiting for the doors to open. There has to be this component that allows them to interact with the host and with each other. Chat is brilliant for that, but so is sending them into breakouts where they’re literally talking with each other because part of the three day framework that works for a high ticket offer is building a like-minded community. You need to experience virtually that wow, you’re from Brazil, you’re from Russia, you’re from wherever. And yet we’re also alike.
BB (20:00):
I think the thing that people were most craving in Covid, but really has always been true of live events is to be surrounded by a group of like-minded people. Like that’s really critical. And so if, if again with livestream what never worked is we’re broadcasting at you versus having an interactive experience where we’re reading your chat. I mean, what I love most now is standing on stage and getting real time feedback on whether you’re with me or not with me. Whether you get the content or you don’t, whether you love what I’m saying or you don’t, whether you have a question, I can pluck that question out and answer it in the moment. It actually starts to be one of those things and you go back to in person, it feels a little flat cuz the most reaction you could get would be a clap, a laugh, or a, you know, callback, right? Like, you know, who’s with me? You know, that kind of thing. So
RV (20:42):
You’re not reading, reading comments. Exactly. Some people put their life story right there in the chat. So yes. But, and, and I agree with this, it’s like most of it previously was there’s a live event happening and the live stream is, we’re letting people watch that, which is, this is, it’s virtual first. We’re talking to them, we’re engaging them. So I’m still like curious about the three, this three day agenda. Like how much of it are you on stage? Are you bringing in guest speakers? How much time are they in breakouts? Like when do you make the offer like that kind of a thing?
BB (21:16):
Yeah, it’s a great question. I mean I think from a high level like macro view, what I really think works in a three day event is what I call the three by three p g. Meaning that you’re doing three things over three days. So each day, three things. The first day our sole focus is content connection, community. I wanna give you amazing content, especially important virtual so that they come back, right? Like for day two and day three, this is not a bait and switch where you have light superficial content. Like give them just enough to be dangerous and then they have to buy the thing to get the real stuff. Your goal is to really give them amazing content that has them having aha after aha after aha. We often call this accumulation effect where every session builds on the one before it. So by the end of the day you have a real idea of a framework.
BB (22:00):
And again, you’re starting to think, I can do that, I will do that. Like this is possible. I will do that. The next piece is connection. Connection to the host, connection to the community. But most importantly, and this is true for in person and virtual events, most importantly a connection to themselves. Like why we come to events is for a sense of what’s possible for us. And I think what people miss a lot on an high ticket offer is, if I don’t believe it’s possible, I’m not gonna pay you to help me make it possible. I have to believe there’s a future in this that I can do this in order for me to want to pay you to help me do it. So that sense of the future self versus the current self is how we start to establish the gap. The gap from where I want to be versus where I am.
BB (22:42):
The minute I see a gap, what do I wanna do? Close the gap, right? And now that I see it, I wanna close it, which gets me to day two. So day one, content connection community day two is about closing that gap. It’s about pain. The exposure of that gap is, I’m in pain now because I can see where I wanna be. I can see where I’m stuck, I really wanna close that gap. I need a solution that’s the s the solution. And then that’s gonna come in the form of an invitation. So it looks like this, wow, I feel like you’re really in pain around the gap in your life or in your business. But here’s the thing I have a solution for that I’d like to invite you to join me to continue the journey for the next six months or for the next year or whatever it might be.
BB (23:24):
So that second day is pain solution invitation. Literally leading people to want your high ticket offer before you’ve even made it so that when they hear it, they’re like, that’s exactly what I was looking for. Like I thought you would, you know why you’re my right fit client, I know you. Which goes back to what you teach R right? It’s like if they’re clear on their big why and their purpose and who they’re meant to serve, you’re designing an offer that they’re gonna love. And then day three is for your logical buyers. And the three things that happen on day three are decide, commit, celebrate. We want you to make a decision to do something differently. You must commit to something different. Don’t let this be three days wasted. Commit to a timeline. When you gonna start, we have a saying, if you don’t have a plan for Monday, you don’t have a plan, like commit to a date to start and then celebrate.
BB (24:10):
What is it gonna look like when you reach that goal? What’s the celebration you’re gonna have when you reach that goal so that they can again, future cast where they’re going to be. Now if in deciding, committing and celebrating you realize that you could use accountability and community and enhanced opportunity that I wanna remind you this offer is still available to you. It’s not too late for you to join us in this program. It allows time for that logical buyer to be like, you know, I really do need to be here. This is what I’m missing. So three days allows for that. So three by three p, g, content, connection, community pain solution, invitation, decision, commitment, celebration. We weave that into every three day. And I say that when you do that, the structure does the selling for you. You don’t have to be icky or salesy or sleazy. If you give generously and follow that model, your right fit clients can be coming to you on day two and saying, I want more, where do I find that? And you’re be like, I thought you would let me invite you to join us
RV (25:04):
So you’re not, I love this. So you’re not, you’re not actually making the offer. So that, so to speak from stage, here’s what it is here, how much it cost until day three. But you’re kind of seeing
BB (25:14):
That day two, actually we make the offer on day two and we reiterate the offer on day three. Yeah. And I really think of it, if you’re familiar with Launch World, for any of you listening, you know, in a launch there’s a cart close, I think of day three is cart close, but also a little bit more heart close. Meaning that what I’m trying to get them to do on day three is get outta their head and into their heart. We make better decisions with their heart than our head. And a three day event allows me to get the offer on the table. On day two, my emotional buyers be like, great, this is what I’m looking for. I’m all in logical. Buyers are gonna say, I have some questions and we’re gonna say, I thought you would, let’s take some time to answer them.
BB (25:50):
And then on day three we get to say, listen, time to decide, time to commit. And if you are gonna do that, here’s a key piece. The celebration for buyers is that day. So you know, I said it was decide, commit, celebrate. If they do join you, you’re gonna reward them for joining you with a welcome celebration. We’re there together with like-minded people, other people who bought into the program and you can really celebrate that. They made such a great decision, not by deciding to invest in you, by deciding to invest in themselves. Like that’s really the key is like, you’re so smart for investing in you. Mm-Hmm.
RV (26:22):
BB (27:04):
Last Yeah, we like to do it at lunch. And I have to tell you, this is what’s interesting for both in person and virtual. The best call to action I’ve ever tested over 17 years of doing this is a welcome celebration. So if you’re in person, you’ve got the cost of lunch. But think about it, if you’re making a high ticket offer 5,000, 10,000, 15,000. And listen, with Russell, we just did an offer that was 150 with Garrett White. We just did an offer that was 500,000. By the way, the economy does not kill a high ticket offer. It just reinforces one. So these big offers are being made right now and selling quite well. But what’s really interesting is still what outperforms anything is that simple. The program starts at this event. The program starts at the welcome celebration. People don’t like to miss the start of something.
BB (27:47):
And it’s something else to keep in mind is you can’t keep people in buying tension for too long. So by making that offer just before dinner on day two, having that dinner break to answer questions and close people having that repitch the next morning, that heart close, and then having that welcome celebration soon after, we’re able to really tighten that moment, which is I know the offer, I have questions about the offer, I have answers to the offer I’m all in. Think about, I must do this, I’m crazy not to do this. And then the reward for doing that. Yeah.
RV (28:17):
Mm-Hmm.
BB (28:53):
Yeah. And this is where Avio comes in again, you know, we need it a way to easily get people to be able to click on a button saying, I’m ready to buy, and to click on a button to say, I need to talk to someone with questions. If you think of in person back of room is where you would go when you hear an offer from the stage. If you have questions, you go to the back of the room. If you wanna buy, you go to the back of the room. We needed a way to virtualize the back of the room. So Avio, think back to what I said, you needed gamification and a way for them to get used to using the dashboard. If they’re clicking around and they’re constantly getting points and rewards for clicking around over two full days, when it comes time to actually click, I’m all in.
BB (29:30):
They’re like, sounds good. They’re used to being on the dashboard, they click the button, they put in their deposit and they’re in. And the ones who are like, but wait, I have questions. You’re like, no problem. Click the button that says talk to a program expert. When you click on it, it’s gonna take you into a room just like the one we’re on right now where you can be led through a q and a session. So it works like a virtual back of room. Yeah. We do the same thing with welcome celebration. You click a button on your dashboard and it lets you into the welcome celebration, which is a private room only for buyers where we can celebrate the decision that you made and give you the next steps. Just like we would at a welcome celebration in person.
RV (30:07):
Mm-Hmm.
BB (30:25):
Deal all over the map. I mean all over the, we have some hosts Yeah, that, I mean we have some events where, you know, I think of like an event with Dean and Tony. We have quite a few guest speakers. And then there are other events where there’s a primary speaker, the host, especially if you’re an up and comer, like one thing I’d love for you to know is you might be modeling people that you love in this space and seeing a lot of guest speakers, but you don’t have a budget for that. It’s so not necessary. Like you don’t have to have an outside speaker to have a really amazing three day event.
RV (30:50):
Uhhuh
BB (31:28):
Yeah, well I think that’s a great question. First of all, remember I said democratization of live events and I’d circle back around to all you really need is a tv, a computer, and a Zoom account. Now Avio is an amazing luxury. It does make things so much easier, but it’s not something you have to have. Like if you’re just getting started, I would have my computer, my Zoom account. You might wonder why a tv, I think it’s critical to have a TV because remember I said it’s about the host experience. If I can see my audience in gallery view much bigger, I’m gonna be able to read your name, I’m gonna be able to see your face, I’m gonna be able to interact with you. I can have that chat. Scroll down the side so I can see what you’re saying back to me. So I’m a big fan of not doing this on your computer.
BB (32:10):
It’s run from your computer, but you’re actually seeing everyone from a TV. And listen, everybody these days has a TV in their home. So this is super easy to do. And if you really wanna get fancy, then here’s an Uplevel move. Take two lights in your house, take the lampshade off and put them right here in front of you so that you’ve got light on your face.
RV (32:38):
That.
BB (32:39):
This is airing, but
RV (32:41):
Quiet tv.
BB (32:42):
Yeah, I mean, but seriously TVs today, a really good TV is $200. So, but
RV (32:46):
You’re saying, but when you say tv, you’re basically just saying a large extended desktop for your computer so that you can see a bunch of people and feel like you’re not alone in your basement, but that you’re actually presenting to a room full of people.
BB (33:00):
Yes. And Avio makes it easy to interact, but you could give a link to your offer. You don’t have to have Avio and you know, we like to give prizes away via leaderboard and activity. But think about this. If you’re having an intimate event, you could take every registrant, put their name on a sheet of paper, put it in a bowl, and at the start of each session, draw a name. Like you could be old school with this, the same things that we did in person to reward people for coming back on time. We can do virtually to reward them for coming back on time. And we wanna do that, we wanna reward them for staying engaged.
RV (33:31):
So, but like if you’re a, I mean, can anyone use abio? Is this like, can we just go log in and buy the thing and use it for our event?
BB (33:38):
You can and it’s, you know, it’s really affordable. I mean, it’s under a thousand dollars for a year. So super easy to use. And I think we’re in like AVIO 5.0 at this point. We have seven full-time developers whose only job is to work on Avio. But it is, I mean interestingly it’s what we use to run an event for GoPro where we have 40,000 people. It’s what we use to run U P W where we have 25,000 people. And here’s something else that’s really interesting. When you think of, how
RV (34:05):
Many, did you say 20,000? 20,000?
BB (34:08):
Yeah, we, we generally do about 25,000 at U P W virtual U P W. And what I think is really interesting about that, I remember the very first virtual U P W and Tony and I were standing there and looking at the gallery view and we’ve got a lot of TVs, a lot of galleries to make that work. Some are in the cloud, some are in the studio, but we were counting, we’re looking in every, and we’re like, there are two people in that box, four people in that box, six people in that box, the classroom in that box, the 25,000 was the people who were registered and showed up. But I think we had probably closer to 75,000. When you look at the number of families or classrooms or friend groups that attended. And honestly I love that. Why would we not want that? You know, you want as many people as possible to be exposed to your message. Say here, sometimes you can’t control the ticketing, but I want you to think about this. How often in an in-person event does your buyer come to the event and they can’t afford to bring their family in and they’re having this incredible experience and they call home, they’re like, this is amazing. Let me try and explain it to you.
RV (35:08):
And I spend 5,000 bucks in like a 10, 2, 2 minute conversation. No, I don’t think so, sweetheart. Yeah.
BB (35:14):
Yes, exactly. They’re like, it sounds like a cult. That sounds expensive. No, come home as soon as possible. The dog just soap on the floor and the kids are cranky, you know, but with virtual you’re like, Hey, come over and check this out. And I can’t tell you how many people love seeing at U P W where you can tell the buyer, like let’s say I’m, I love Tony, I’m going to unleash the part with, and my spouse is like, nah, that’s not for me. And you’ll watch that spouse kind of walk back and forth behind and then finally the spouse is like, huh, interesting. And then they lean in. Yeah. And then they’ll life
BB (35:43):
Changing. Yeah. Before you know it, they’re sitting on the sofa, then they’re jumping up and down and then before you know it, the kids in the family are there. So what I most love about it, when you think about something like that brand, how often would a nine year old get exposed to personal development? Right? Well now that’s absolutely possible. So I just think the power of virtual isn’t just that you can do it from anywhere. Like literally a computer, a TV, and a Zoom account. You can do it from your home, do it from your basement, do it from your garage. Your attendees can do it from anywhere. So you could be a brand new speaker, author, or course creator and literally have a global audience. Even if your audience is 50 or five. I mean, if you’re like waiting to get started, why not do an event for five people? I mean, what better way to test
RV (36:26):
It out? Does it matter how much you charge on the front end?
BB (36:29):
I really believe in not less than $97 for a ticket.
RV (36:34):
Okay. But that, by the way, I think it’s the’s $7 for three days is like, that’s
BB (36:39):
Amazing.
RV (36:39):
Very, that’s nothing
BB (36:40):
Very affordable. But I think if you were to look at the blended average in our industry, the ticket price in person and virtually quite frankly is somewhere in the 97 to 1 97 range. And by the way, we don’t charge less for virtual. You shouldn’t either. I mean, it’s actually in some ways a better experience and think about it travels up 47% right now. Flights, hotel costs, you know, we’re in a recession inflation. So when your attendee has to buy a hotel, you know, buy a flight, get a hotel room, Uber, then pay for the food down in the lobby and the $7 coffee and whatever they’re feeling broke before they even walk into your room. And virtual, they’re literally just bargaining with their family to give them the time. Like that’s all it takes is honey, can I just have three quiet days to attend this event so that I can change our life or I can change my business. It’s a much easier barter to be able to say, I’ll still tuck the kids in at the end of the night and if you’re really quiet, I’ll make you dinner during my dinner break. I mean, you can do all of that now through the power of virtual
RV (37:36):
Mm-Hmm.
BB (37:53):
Or a $15,000 offer or a $50,000 offer. I mean, just to be clear, the offers that we’re making virtually go up to 500 k I mean successfully. So it’s no different from in person when it comes to the size offer that you can make.
RV (38:08):
What, what kind of conversions do you expect to see on this Barry? Like if you go, I mean let’s say you get, let’s say you get, you know, 200 people to show up for three days and then is that a very different conversion percentage wise if you get 2000 or 20,000? Or do the percentages kind of hold the same?
BB (38:30):
Yeah, it’s such a great question. I love this question cuz I think a lot of people get this wrong. First of all, I think that it, an intimate event converts better whether in person or virtual.
RV (38:41):
Interesting. So smaller is not bad.
BB (38:43):
No. Smaller is actually fantastic. And the bigger the event host, you’ll have them like kind of remember the days when we were smaller and how amazing that was. So, you know, everybody wants to be the big event host, but you know, really a smaller room convert, it’s more intimate. It does tend to convert better than a larger room, but a larger room has more volume. So it’s not like you don’t want a larger room as you grow, that volume works for you. So we might convert less at a 25,000 person event than we do at a 2000 person event, but we have more people. So we’re still making more money technically. Right? So, but I want you to think about the fact that in person a good solid blended average conversion is 20% and virtual it’s more 10 to 15. So it’s slightly below. But we tend to see virtual registrations outpace in person. So we tend to see if, you know, blended average year over year, we see more people register for virtual than in person. So the fact that our conversions are lower is outweighed by the fact that more people are there and they’re staying with us all day and they’re staying with us till the very end of the event.
RV (39:41):
Yeah, okay. But if you had 200 people buy a hundred dollars ticket, they stay there for three days, you, you would expect that maybe 20 to 30 of those people after three days would buy a, some a $5,000 offer maybe.
BB (40:00):
Yeah, I would have a stretch goal of 10, a minimum goal of 10% and a stretch goal of 20%. And for those of you that are more practiced in delivering your content, making offers, you can increase that conversion accordingly.
RV (40:12):
Yeah,
BB (40:13):
So you can do the math, like imagine if you’re just getting started and you went to have an event for 50 people and make a $5,000 offer. Let’s say that five people took you up on that and you made $25,000 from your basement at your first ever live event and launched your high ticket offer. Like that’s a pretty good, we call it a purpose driven payday. Like what I love to say about a live event is that it’s a purpose driven payday. You can have impact and income, purpose and payday. You don’t have to sacrifice one for the other. And there’s no better blaze to try this out than through a virtual event versus having to go get that hotel contract we were talking about where you have real liability. And if that worked, imagine f a quarter later, three months later you’re like, you know, that was so easy, I’m gonna do it again. And at another five people, oh wow, I got so much better. I actually converted 10, not five. And then the next one I didn’t have 50 people. Words started to get out how amazing I am. I had a hundred people. So it’s really easy to start scaling your high ticket offer and literally launch your mastermind, your group coaching business, your done four, you service your high ticket offer through the power of a virtual live event.
RV (41:14):
Mm-Hmm.
BB (41:30):
Not even, and even at our own studio, like we have a studio right now we have five cameras in our studio, but we do this for a living and we’re bringing in some of the biggest names in our space to work out of our studio. So of course we have multiple camera angles and we have a control room and we have an AVD crew. But you don’t need that to get started. You don’t need a big list, you don’t need a big studio, you don’t need a big production and you don’t need a big budget. Like that’s what’s amazing about this. You don’t need all these camera angles. This is about you being engaging. I would recommend standing. I do think it’s important to stand.
RV (42:02):
Interesting. Yeah. Yeah, just cuz you’re in presentation mode for two days. Yeah. so you guys, so that’s another thing that we can do. So, so basically people can engage you to buy avio if they want to do this. And then I guess avio must allow for you to pull in multiple camera angles. I guess there’s that a zoom, is that a Zoom
BB (42:23):
Feature That’s more of a Zoom thing and a switcher thing, like advance level move that would be having a switcher. So you can do that, but even that is super easy to do and some of our students who are just getting started out take that basic equipment and use that. Absolutely.
RV (42:37):
Okay. And then so, so, but then Avio allows you to do the event registration, the gamification, the leaderboards, you have your own little buttons there, click here to talk to somebody. Or if you’re a solopreneur or whatever, you just say, click here to schedule a call with me and you send them to Callen Lee or whatever. And and then so, or
BB (42:58):
You guys ideal, like if they have a question, they just click a button on Avio, it takes them into a Zoom room. And if you’re just getting started and you don’t have a sales team, then you would be the person in that room answering the questions. But if you do have a team member, a family member who can help you, they could be in that Zoom room helping to ask answer questions. A student, a volunteer. Well
RV (43:16):
I just mean if you’re running the event, how you, you can’t, you need somebody else to kind of be there, right. To
BB (43:21):
Do that. Well the minute you walk off stage, you go over to, you know, a computer that’s been Yep. And you just answer the questions. Absolutely. Yeah. Super easy to do. Yeah.
RV (43:29):
And then the other thing is, you guys have a studio where it’s like, okay, I don’t want to deal with the tech, can I just like, can I promote the event and then you guys deal with all this, that’s also something that you
BB (43:39):
Do. It is, yeah. We’re in the done for you business. Yeah. We coach people on how to do it, but we also do it for them. You can come to the studio and do that.
RV (43:47):
Yeah. And then are you, are you also in the I want to, I’m gonna have 5,000 people at my thing and I want you, you know, to come to Nashville and set it, set it all up and kind of like we run it from here and not your studio. Clearly that’s what you did with Tony. Yeah,
BB (44:05):
Yeah. We do that. Yeah. We help, we collaborate with other studios and we also we’ll do what we call a popup studio or even an in-person event, which kind of gets me too, the next question is, should you be doing a hybrid? Cause you’re like, well, if in person’s great and virtual’s great, shouldn’t you know peanut butter, chocolate, amazing. Let’s put ’em together. Yeah. But I really think if you’re an up and comer, you, it’s an and nutton or I don’t think you, I think you should like, these are my in person dates and these are my virtual dates. I don’t think you try and put them together. It is super complicated to run a hybrid event. You need a depth of budget team and resources. It’s much harder to do if you’re gonna do it well. Which is why I think you’re gonna see the biggest names in the business do it.
BB (44:46):
And everyone below that say it really doesn’t pay to do it. I love virtual, I love in person. Virtual doesn’t replace in person, it’s the new and not, or, and I think more and more you’re gonna see people are like, these are my in-person dates and these are my virtual dates versus these are my hybrid dates. And the simple reason for it is that you can’t help but pander to an in-person audience. Like it is the rare host that doesn’t focus on in person, which immediately takes that interactivity, that makes virtual work and reduces it back to that telecast that broadcast, that’s a super passive experience. So if you’re debating this, my recommendation would be if you’re just getting started out, start with a virtual event because it’s so much easier. The net is so much better. Grow into it. When you’re confident in the model, then you can put your money on the line with an in person event. Or if you’re more advanced, make it the, and you know, these are my dates from person, these are my dates for virtual.
RV (45:37):
How many, this is kind of like a last question, but the, what’s the maximum number of people you can have watching these? So that’s another reason to use Abio, right? Because on Zoom you can only have 500 or, I mean, it depends on your account.
BB (45:50):
That is the advantage. Like we’re working, we’re, we’re close friends with the folks at Obvi at zoom. So we work hand in hand with them. We have enterprise accounts which allow you to scale quickly and easily for any size event you’re having. It also adds a layer of security. You know how you can have like a little bit of Zoom bombing and you don’t want, you, you don’t mind if a spouse watches your event, but what you don’t want is somebody just giving the link out and have 50 of their friends log in without paying. Avio gives you a gateway to that so you can control who’s accessing the event.
RV (46:21):
Uhhuh.
BB (46:35):
Yeah, thank you for asking. I mean, the simple easy way is [email protected]. You would think that we would have a really swanky website, a place that I would drive you. But the truth is we’ve been running so hard since virtual hit. I’m embarrassed. Please don’t go to my website. Don’t even think about it. Just go to [email protected] and our team will
RV (46:54):
Go to, you’re saying email, you’re saying send an
BB (46:56):
Email to Yes. Go to event zip by sage.com. Yeah, we do run an event every year called the virtual Event on virtual events. We run it twice a year and we teach not only the model for how we do what we do but also how to design your high ticket offer, how to take it one to many, how to design your live event around it so that people are naturally saying, that was amazing. I want more. And how to use the technology, how to set up your own studio and how to use Avio so that you can make it all work seamlessly.
RV (47:23):
Yeah, well I think it’s great. It’s a great example. We teach, we tell our clients like, you don’t need fancy website. What you need to do do is deliver great value. Teach everything you know for free. People don’t pay for information, they pay for applications. So just go teach what, you know, give out an email address and let them just contact you and then you’ll go for there. So I’d love that.
BB (47:44):
And you know, probably if you’re really smart, hire Rory to make you look a lot
RV (47:48):
Better.
BB (48:13):
Thank you. Thank you so much for having me.
Ep 353: How to Create an Environment You Thrive In | Lori Harder Episode Recap
AJV (00:02):
Hey all, this is AJ Vaden and welcome to my recap episode of my conversation with my friend Laurie, harder. And y when I say go listen to this particular episode, I mean, go listen to this particular episode. It’s so, so good, so many nuggets. It’s so rich. We cover so many topics. It’s legit. I don’t care where you want your business, there is something in there for you. So without further ado, I’ll give you kind of like some of my key takeaways from this conversation, which quite honestly was just as impactful for me if it was, if it as it is going to be for any of you. It was so, so good. So here are a few things that I just pulled out that were phenomenally important to me that just hit me in a certain way, so hopefully they hit you the same way.
AJV (00:56):
So the first thing is we started the whole conversation of just remember that you have a choice. And I think that’s just a good reminder for anyone, no matter where you are in life, it’s, you have a choice of how you feel. You have a choice of your attitude. You have a choice of whether or not you’re happy today or you’re stressed today. And I’m not saying that we don’t have days where we’re stressed and overwhelmed. I have those days often, but those are also choices I make. And it’s, I think it, the difference is am I choosing to focus on the things that aren’t going well? Or am I choosing to focus on the things that are, and it’s not that you ignore the things that aren’t they need fixing, but it’s choosing to put your, your, your hope and your aspirations in the things that are working and not get bogged down by the things that aren’t.
AJV (01:44):
It’s, are you choosing little things that make you feel good versus choosing things that don’t make you feel good? I know for me it’s like, am I choosing to go on a walk or am I choosing a glass of wine? I need to choose a to go on a walk, right? And it’s like you have a choice. You have a choice about are you gonna be disciplined and do the things you know you’re supposed to do or are you not? Are you going to do it? Even if you think it doesn’t make a difference, even though it does or not. It’s like you have a choice and all the things, you have a choice. And I think that is just a good place, a good foundation to start for the rest of this conversation is we all have choices to make. How we spend our time, our attitudes, how we feel, how we treat people.
AJV (02:31):
Those are choices that we get to make. And we do have influence and control over those things so you have a choice. So that was the first thing I think that was really good. Second thing is similar to that is you have a choice in your environment. Now, sometimes we are temporarily stuck in an environment, but that doesn’t mean we can’t create counter environment. So maybe you are temporarily in a, a job per se that isn’t healthy for you and you can’t just up and leave. You have bills to pay, you have a family to take care of, you have responsibilities, but there can be other environments that you surround yourself with i e community outside of work that help counter negative environment. So your environment is a really important part of your ability to make progress. And I love what Laurie said, and I’m totally just stealing this right out of her mouth.
AJV (03:24):
Your environment has a mental, emotional and physical impact on you. And if you are not consciously making decisions, choices to improve your environment, then your mental, emotional and physical wellbeing will suffer. So let’s all just take a second, take a step back and go, what environments am I in that are healthy and good and, you know, moving me in the right direction? And what environments may I be in that are not those things, and how do I have more of the good and less of the not so good? Right? And I think, again, it’s like environments can be places. They can be groups of people, they can be communities, they can be all different sorts of things. But I know for me, and I love what she said when she talks about her childhood and an environment she was used to seeing versus a new environment when she went to go stay with a family a a set of friends.
AJV (04:23):
And she was like, whoa, whoa, whoa. What is this? I, I didn’t even know this existed. If we don’t create new environments, then we convince ourselves that things are just the way that they are. We don’t even know things are possible cuz we’ve never seen them be possible for anyone in our environment. So it’s, I think it’s just so incredibly important to have different and varying environments so that you see new patterns and new habits and new ways of living or thinking or acting or doing that create new possibilities for you. I don’t remember who said this first, but it’s like, you know, it’s like you are who you hang out with. Well, I think that’s probably true for most of us. It’s like we are the, you know, culmination of where we spend our time, energy, thinking resources, right? That begins to create who we are.
AJV (05:12):
So what environments are you in and what environments do you need to be in? I love this quote. This is so good. And she said that your environments are often stronger than your willpower. So if you know that you have a temptation to do things that you don’t want to do, then remove yourself from those environments, right? If you’re trying to eat healthy, then do not put yourself environments where it’s, you know, chips and dips and nachos and hamburgers and hot dogs, right? Remove yourself from those environments. If you hang out with a group of people who aren’t healthy and you’re trying to be healthy, remove yourself from those sorts of temptations, not from the people, from the environments, right? See them on a hike, see them doing something else. But you’ve got to know that if you’ve got struggles in the willpower discipline arena, then you’ve got to change the environment.
AJV (06:09):
So, so good. Oh my gosh, this isn’t like brand new, but such a new fresh context of looking at this really does hit it in a different way. And just remembering, it’s like your environment is often stronger than your willpower. So good. Love this. Okay, moving right along here. This next one is like same kind of quote where I’m like, this should just be all over lord’s social media. I don’t know why this isn’t everywhere she goes, but there is always a gift in what you just did. And if you have ever said to yourself, I just wasted so much time, or I just wasted so much money, or what a bunch of waste of time, resources, emotions, I would just encourage you to rephrase that and go, you wasted nothing. You learned a ton, a ton about what you should do and what you shouldn’t do, what you want and what you don’t want.
AJV (07:10):
But there is a gift in what you just did. And a lot of times that gift comes in experience and it comes in knowledge and cl it comes in clarification. But there is an a, there is a gift in what you just did, whether it was a success or it was a temporary failure, whether it worked out or it didn’t. There was a gift in what you just did. You just have to make the choice to look for it. And that is so powerful because often we look at things that don’t work out as failures and we look at failures as a waste of time. And I’m currently reading a book right now called, called to Create by Jordan Rainer. And in this book he talks about something in Silicon Valley where they talk about the fail faster rule. And that’s just my my, my synopsis of what he is talking about.
AJV (08:04):
I don’t know if that’s really what he said in the book, but this is how I remember it anyways. But the fail, the fail faster role is like in Silicon Valley. It’s like if your startup fails fast, that means that you’re learning just as fast. So it’s like if you haven’t failed, then you haven’t tried hard enough, risked enough that there hasn’t been something that happened enough. And I think that’s both healthy and potentially not as long as we’re willing to express that. You know, failure does not, failures do not mean we are a failure. That means we did things that didn’t work. Welcome to life.
AJV (08:54):
Experience. And so creating different ways of looking at this of like what are the lessons learned? What are the gifts I received from what I just did? Because nothing was a waste of time. There was something that was received, there was something that was learned. There was something that came out of it that is going to make you a better person, but you gotta make the choice to find it. So just, I thought that was such a good reminder of everything that we do, whether it was a, an investment loss or it was a business loss, a relationship loss. Where is in the, what is the gift in what you just did? Also in, in the wins, right? There’s clearly gifts in the wins. I think it’s easier for us to find those, but it’s, it’s a mental, a discipline to find the gifts and the things that we don’t consider wins.
AJV (09:43):
But there is always a gift in what you just did, I just thought was so good. Now, tactically speaking there were a few other things that I wanna share that I thought were equally as powerful here. So with courses we talked about the concept of less is more. The whole idea of this, it’s like you want to save, like this is what we say at brand builders all the time, is you wanna save the best for first. Because if you give, if you serve up the best first, if you give your audience the best first they feel accomplished faster, they feel more empowered faster, they feel more educated, more knowledgeable they feel like they can do things right up front. And so you wanna give them as much as you can as early as you can because that shows a very quick return on their investment.
AJV (10:29):
They don’t need to spend six hours and 66 pages to feel like they got their money’s worth. You want them to feel like they got their money, their money’s worth in the first hour. So how can you do less is more and help them feel accomplished way up front. Love that. Second thing about courses is just don’t forget that fundamentals never get old. We think we have to create some new twists and make new shiny objects and, you know, talk about a brand new way of doing something. And sometimes people don’t need a brand new way of doing something. They just need to hear it in a new way. They need to hear the solid, basic fundamentals in a way that hits them, right? The whole concept of there’s always a gift in what you just did. You could say that a hundred different ways, but the way that Lori said that hit me, right?
AJV (11:17):
The fact that she said, you know, your environments often are stronger than your willpower. It’s not like that has never been said before. She’s never been said that way. And so sometimes it’s not that you’re saying brand new stuff, you’re just saying in a way that your audience can relate to in a way that they don’t relate to the way someone else says it. So just don’t forget like fundamentals don’t get old. Just make sure to share it in your lens and your perspective and provide as much value as possible right up front. Now, when it comes to podcasts, Lori’s podcast now has more than 47 million downloads. So how do you go from a new podcast or a podcast that maybe has a few thousand downloads to millions of downloads? I thought this was really good. Keep it simple. It’s fundamentals, but talk about it everywhere you go.
AJV (12:06):
It’s be consistent. Don’t give up. It takes time. But talk about it everywhere you go. Ask people to share it. Ask people to rate it. Ask people to give reviews on it. But talk about it and then ask people to do what you want them to do. We talked about how it’s like if you never ask, the answer is always no. So you’ve got to ask, remind people, tell people this is how you can help talk about it everywhere you go and tell people what to do. That’s how you grow your podcast and need to do those two things consistently right. Now, last but not least, we also talked about stepping into the world of physical products, right? So that could be anything from t-shirt, shoes to water bottles, wine, food, snacks, nutritional supplements, the list goes on and on and on.
AJV (12:58):
Could be any sort of physical product going from an an educational and information product world to a physical product world. And what are some of the things that we need to know and what should we be looking for if we are considering making this transition or adding a physical product line to our business offering? So first, find some help
AJV (13:53):
That’s the first thing. Second is make sure that you’re just filling a need that you see in the market. Don’t think don’t, don’t create a product as you think there’s a need. Find a need and then create a product to fulfill that need, right? And if you’ve got a trusted audience, you can start by asking them that fill a need that you already see in the marketplace. Cuz there is there. Focus on why your product is different than competing products, right? So focus on what differentiate your products. How are you gonna market it differently? How does it help differently? How does it serve your audience differently? How is it made for your audience specifically? So focus on your differentiator. I love this one that this was so pa impactful. Avoid any sort of products as your first product that have lots of legal tape, right? So anything that would require like fda regulatory issues, anything that, you know, like beauty products,
Speaker 3 (14:51):
Food, beverage nutritional lines, anything that has lots and lots of legal take. What’s gonna happen is most of your investment money or your own money is going to be going to the lawyers versus product development, research and development marketing. Most of it’s actually just gonna go to the pockets of attorneys versus actually helping develop your product. So as your first product entry to market, avoid anything that has lots of legal red tape almost to the end of my list here, focus on one thing. In other words, don’t create a product line that has lots of s skews first. So if you’re gonna create a makeup line start with one thing, right? Is it a lip gloss? Then stick to that. Is it a mascara stick to that. Don’t go, here’s an entire makeup on, we’re gonna have this and this and this and this.
Speaker 3 (15:42):
It’s like, no, start with one thing. So you have centralized focus on what works. You do all of your checks and balances, all your trial and error, all of your market testing with one product. So you get the marketing right, you get the audience right, you get the pricing right? You get the packaging and the shipping and all the things right on one product, and then you expand from there. So start with one sku, one product and that will save you lots of time, lots of money, and actually help you generate revenue. So y’all, there’s so many things I could talk for another 20 minutes on this. But I’m looking at my timer and my time is up. So go check out this full interview. Catch us next time on the influential personal brand. And if this has been helpful to you, please go and like this episode, share this episode, comment on it, leave us a review, rate it. If this is helpful to you and you think it would be helpful to someone else, please share it with them. You get to be the conduit of sharing good information out into the world. So I’m asking for your help. If you like our podcast, the influential personal brand, please like it, share it, leave a review and get it out into the world and share it with a friend. So thank you so much. We’ll see you next time on the influential Personal brand.
Ep 352: 5 Simple Things You Can Do To Better Build Your Personal Brand with Lori Harder
AJV (00:02):
Hey everybody. This is AJ Vaden on the Influential Personal Brand. Welcome to another episode. So genuinely excited to have my friend Lori Harder on the show today. You guys are in for a super awesome special treat because Lori really is the epitome of someone who has taken her reputation and all of the success and all of the things that she’s accomplished and turned it into so many different things over the course of her career. So let me just tell you for a quick second why you need to stick around. Then I’m gonna formally introduce Lori if you don’t already know about her. And then we’re gonna hop into this. But here’s what I would tell you. If you are a person who is in any sort of transition and you’re trying to figure out how do I make a successful transition from one career to another, one industry to another, one company to another, this is the one to be a show that is very much going to help you.
AJV (01:02):
Or if you’re a person who is, let’s say you’re doing many things, but you’re trying to figure out how do you make them consistent and have a good through line so that everything feels like it’s connected, then this is an episode for you. Or if you’re trying to figure out what lane do you really want to be in, this is an episode that was truly built to serve the needs of those questions and for those of you who are going through this process. So with that said, I will now give you a formal introduction of the one and the Only Lori Harder, and then we’re gonna hop in and actually let her talk for a second. So quick interview or quick overview. If you don’t know Lori Lori has built three that is right, three separate seven figure businesses. She is the founder and CEO of a new product line, which we will talk a lot about the evolution of this process as we go through this.
AJV (02:02):
She’s also go a bestselling author of a Tribe called Bliss. She’s the host of the Earn Your Happy podcast, which is if you don’t listen to it, it is a must listen to podcast with more than 46 million downloads, which is incredible. She also is a co-host of another awesome podcast called Girlfriends and Business. She has a lot going on but she also has all this other really cool background information that you may not know. Like you may not know that she was a three time world champion in the fitness industry. She’s an 11 time fitness cover model. She was a gym owner. She’s a seven figure business owner through a direct sales network marketing company. And the list kind of goes on and on and on, which is one of the reasons that I wanted to have her on the show today is because she is someone who has been there, done that, seen the ups, seen the dams, and is still here to tell you all about it. It. So without further ado, Lori, welcome to the show.
LH (03:03):
Ah, I’m so excited to be here. And you guys, it’s been so much fun having you on my show too. So if you wanna like hear the reverse of this, you can go on on that near it.
AJV (03:24):
This is all of the amazing,
LH (03:25):
Hold on a minute.
AJV (03:26):
That’s that accumulates over the years. Yes,
LH (03:29):
Totally.
AJV (03:30):
But like truly like in all honesty, you have done so many amazing things and I bet a ton of our listeners know about you probably follow you, but then I bet there’s a fair share where this is their first introduction to you. And so just to help kinda give everyone a little bit of background, can you just tell us a little bit about how your career started and how you got to where you are now?
LH (03:55):
Yes. I’m gonna give you a brief overview. So I’m gonna skim through some things, but the reason that I’m gonna go way back for a minute is just because I want everyone to know that no matter where you’re from, what your education level is, you truly can create any life that you want. And my story will show that and, and prove that I’m from a really small town in upper Michigan. Like most people don’t even know Michigan has an upper part. Like truly they’re like, it’s lower Michigan, Detroit. No, there is something way up in the woods that is more Canada than Canada is
LH (04:44):
It made what I saw in the world as possible. Very small. It made you know what I thought people were capable of doing very, very small. And that’s not to say it negative, it’s to show you the picture of I didn’t really get to exist outside of this circle. So a lot of the work that I have done now and out in the world and what my book is based on and why I’m so passionate about having these conversations on podcasts is because we need to see what is possible through other people and hear these stories. So doing that when I was 18 years old, I decided to leave, which meant I had a choice. And I believe that you guys all have this. You’re, you’re facing a really tough choice like this right now where you’re going to leave everyone and everything behind.
LH (05:30):
And some of you don’t have to leave things behind. But some of you may have to make the choice to leave things behind and build a future that is completely built in the uncertain and in the risk with new people that you have never met in your entire life. And this obviously isn’t done overnight, but this is what majority of the things that I have done is based on is because I think that everyone who is in a pivot and in a transition is in that moment that I was in when I was 18, choosing, do I choose this very uncertain future or do I go back and stay in my very like contingent based happiness or contingent based group and love? Or do I go and try to figure out what this call is on my heart and why in the heck I’m waking up every single night and why I have low key anxiety 24 7.
LH (06:21):
And this is the place where I just started building everything else. It was like the, the, the first, I think the first big awakening and just breakthrough for me was realizing when I, when I had started working out, I come from a family that dealt with a lot of anxiety. Most of my family was all on some sort of medication or depression medication or anxiety medication. And they were all overweight. And the first big moment for me was when I was in middle school, I went and stayed with a family because our congregations were far away from each other. They were like two hours. So I ended up staying with the family for a week. And first I wanna just say I love my family more than anything. You could still love them and you can also want to be different.
LH (07:07):
So
LH (07:49):
I went home, I lost five pounds. Like I literally had been dieting since I was eight years old. Ended up losing five pounds in this one week that I was there. Cause we were so active and we ate really healthy. What did this do for me being in that environment without even trying made me or, or turned me into something else? Right? I actually got a physical result. I had a mental result. I felt really good and I couldn’t unsee it. And that was the moment for me where I really started getting into fitness and saying, okay, I want to help people transform because fitness has transformed my life so much. So I, I pretty much spent the first from probably 20 to 30 was really that dedication to like that fitness portion of my life in transforming people.
AJV (08:35):
Can I pause right there for just one second? Yes. Cause you said something that I think is so impactful and maybe it’s just hitting me personally right now because one of my childhood best friends right now is in recovery and she’s actually in a program right now. And one of the things that they told her her in this inpatient program is, you know, there are three changes that you have to make if you wanna see real change. Mm. You have to change people, places and things. Oh. And what you just said right there is a really important thing about you said is like your environment actually can have a, a physical manifestation in your life. And it’s like, I think it’s really amazing of going, nothing else changed for you other than being in a new environment. And because you acclimated to that new environment, other things started happening.
AJV (09:26):
A lot can happen in a really good way and in a really bad way. So I’m just kind of curious, it’s like, did, did you notice that in the moment of going, whoa, whoa, whoa. Like this is so different. And then did you notice like the environment made a change? And I’m just kind of curious for everyone who is out there who is, you know, kind of sitting there going, I don’t really love where I am or what I’m doing, or, or they suffer from comparison for whatever reason we all do it. Like what kind of impacts have you seen around that environmental change?
LH (10:02):
I, so I think environment is everything. I think your environment is stronger than any willpower you can create on your own in that prior environment that you’re in. So when I go to make a change or a pivot, this is a huge part of pivoting. When I go to make a change or a pivot, I simultaneously look at what I will have to do, like what kind of habits I will have to do, but what kind of environment I will now have to either buy into, put myself in, or even be looking at, right? Cuz it’s, it’s all of the input. It’s, it’s what we’re reading, it’s what we are looking at and consuming on social media. It’s what conversations we’re having. Mm-Hmm.
LH (10:55):
So whenever I’ve done anything, let’s say when I went from fitness to personal development, I went from going to all the fitness events, reading all the fitness magazines, looking up to all the fitness people. My vision board was full of fitness things and fitness goals to just like that, looking at who is helping people write books, who is authors, who’s an author that has a podcast who is in the space of like writing books that help people write books. I hired a coach for writing books and overnight I flipped everything and set myself up in an environment where it would support me moving forward on the goal of writing a book. And I think that that was a big reason why number one, I was able to like go from you guys. I did not graduate high school. That’s another thing I wanted to share. Went from like an eighth grade reading level to writing a book because I had coaches and had to understand how to do it. And I put so much specific time into that thing. And so I think environment is literally everything.
AJV (11:55):
I think that is like, this is gonna be one of those quotes that I pull out and post all over social media that is so good. It’s like your environment is often stronger than your own willpower. Mm-Hmm.
LH (13:03):
Yeah. It’s easy to forget when you’re with
AJV (13:04):
Me. All these things. I think this is so awesome. I love this. So on this conversation, you went from really having this incredible fitness career to being a cover model, to owning a gym, to then having, you know, this seven figure very successful, which you still have you know, business and network marketing to then transitioning from this that kind of world to this whole new world of more like information products with courses and books and events and a podcast. Tell me how on God’s green earth did you make these transitions successfully? Because I think that’s where a lot of people struggle. It’s like they’ve been known for this one thing for forever and now they’re trying to do this life pivot and they kind of get stuck with, well, people aren’t gonna know me for this, I’m not known as this. And then they just kind of give up. Mm. How did you do that successfully?
LH (14:05):
I don’t know if I figured this out in the beginning or if this was, you know, I think some of the things we do were just kind of, we don’t even realize we’re following a bit of like desire and intuition. But I, I not long down the path started to realize that if you know how to attract people to you as like a, whether that’s a personal brand or whether you are a CEO or founder of something, if you understand how to attract people to you, you can almost funnel them into anything, in my personal opinion. So what do I mean by that? I mean that even if right now I didn’t have any of those things and I was trying to figure out what I wanted to do, do, I would just start talking about the things that I was interested in right now.
LH (14:56):
Like maybe I’m like, maybe I wanna start a products company or maybe I wanna start like a skincare line, or maybe I wanna start a wine brand. What I would start doing is talking about wanting to start those things and like the, the journey of what I’m feeling going through it and maybe the journey of how am I setting up my environment, like what we just talked about. And I would be consistent with it because, and, and this is truly what I did. I, I didn’t necessarily always know what I was rolling into, but I always shared the journey of what, where I was at and what I was feeling and what I was thinking consistently every single day. And I think there’s so many people out there that I think it’s everyone, right? We all are on this journey of, of desiring to evolve.
LH (15:39):
And so I think if that is the topic of desiring to evolve and how are you doing it and what does it look like and what are you doing that’s different and what is, you know, what is this journey? Who did you have to maybe leave behind? What was that feeling? All of a sudden I realized I had this audience who was pretty tuned into what I had to say. Mm-Hmm.
LH (16:23):
So whether the product is a book or whether the product is an actual physical product, that company is serving something that I, I feel needs to be served or a need that I see or that I have. And it’s, it’s based off of my personal core values. So I don’t become, I don’t have to become a different person as I pivot into different businesses, I literally get to show up fully me in every single business because it is literally based off of my core values and, and my desires and, and a need at one time. So it’s not hard for me to talk about any of the products that I’ve ever created, whether it’s a e-course or whether it’s a book or whether it’s a physical product because I base all of these things off of things that I either was and lessons I’ve learned.
LH (17:10):
So it’s very easy for me to obviously talk to my past self and talk you through you know, what I went through or it’s very easy for me to be like, this is what I needed and here’s what it does for me. And it’s a part of my life every day so it doesn’t feel unnatural. Where sometimes I know we can maybe be thinking of products or something like that, that you’re like, oh well that’s making money. Maybe I should do that. And then it feels very awkward. Mm-Hmm.
AJV (17:45):
Yeah. I tell you what, that, that is so vitally important. Cause I think a lot of people make their decisions about what businesses or what products or services to get into based on some sort of market analysis or market research. And you’re saying no, it’s the opposite of what are my core values and how do I exhibit those into products or services that I think will serve the people who need ’em because I needed them. And if I did, then so do others. And I think that’s a really strong way, which quite honestly is probably going to be the answer to my next question,
LH (18:19):
AJV (18:19):
Which is how have you kept everything consistent mm-hmm.
LH (18:41):
Yes. I I, so I love this question though, taking it to like the, the second level of this is, you know, what you can do, especially as you pivot, there is always a gift in what you just did. Even if, even if what you just got done with, or maybe you were working a corporate job that you feel like you’re like, ah, I wasted two years of my life or five years of my life. Absolutely not. There are so many gifts that that past thing has given you that you are going to get to integrate into this new thing of yours. I was just thinking about how my past of doing e-courses and meditations and speaking in public and learning to create a talk is gonna help me so much with getting this new product out because I am going to get the product out through events.
LH (19:26):
And if I hadn’t, you know, spoken publicly, if I hadn’t felt like I can just get up in, in front of a crowd now and connect with them on a very human level then I wouldn’t have this great modality and these great ideas around, okay, we’re gonna do events, we’re gonna do some challenges that maybe we include like, you know, some daily rituals and maybe a meditation. Like these are all things that are coming from my past that are now making me think in the grand scheme of honestly, I’m thinking about how do we create community? Because if you can create, you already have a community essentially. If you’re creating your own personal brand, I just want to now take the community I have, insert a product and create even more community around it. So essentially I’m gonna continue being me and building community and also say, this is one of the things I’m obsessed with that I use every single day.
LH (20:16):
And this is what our community does. Or, you know, choose it if you like it. And that’s been, I think that that has been such a huge realization for me is, is if you can build that community, it’s kind of like, what, what does the community need? What are they doing? What are the healthy rituals? What are the, what are the habits of this community? How, how do you, how do you want to connect them to each other? Cuz that’s next level community, right? Like, that’ll really take your community deeper. And it’s just kind of of like rinse and repeat, rinse and repeat that same idea.
AJV (20:50):
You know, what’s interesting is that even as I sit here thinking through all of the things that you’ve done through your career that I can already just hearing you talk, pull out as an outsider looking in, what are some of the through lines that I see, which I think is really fascinating that I didn’t correlate to before, but now hearing you talk about some of your core values and it’s just things that you believe in. It’s like health is a theme through every single thing that you do. Happiness, community, like those are themes through every single thing that you do. And I, so I’m curious, it’s, was that intentional? Like, did you like kind of like outline those before and was that a very strategic decision or did it just evolve and happen naturally?
LH (21:35):
You know, I think I really realized the power of community when I had started the Bliss Project and also when I had started writing that book, because simultaneously while I was doing those things, I was in search. I had, I had told you guys at the beginning of this podcast and aj you know, like I was looking for my own community because I had started kind of the, the fitness thing is a very solo journey. Like, you’re, you’re pretty, you have to be pretty self consumed to get to that point and stay at that point with your body. You, you, you kind of have to be pretty selfish. It’s, it’s actually, it’s actually fairly hard to be social because you really need to control, especially when you’re competing all the time, you really unfortunately need to control what’s going in your mouth 24 7.
LH (22:19):
And it can get really tough if you’re very social. So when I got out of that, and that’s a whole other thing that I had to like, figure out how to like recalibrate and be what does normal look like? What is health? What does normal healthy look like? And I, those words aren’t even the right words to be using. It’s just trying to figure out what, what works for me, what, what is like truly a baseline that feels really good. And so from there I was like so freaking lonely. Like I had started, you know, even, even my when I started the membership, I had a fitness membership, you guys, and, and that was a huge focus for me. That was one of the first things that I really outside of network marketing also started making money with was, it was around the same time I had launched a fitness membership and, and we would do challenges where they were, they started as 30 day challenges, then they went to 14, then we realized people had the attention span that only seven days would work
AJV (23:17):
Try and error.
LH (23:18):
Yes. And even from that, you know, I launched those challenges. We, we were trying to get those right for three years. So I didn’t just throw it out and say, oh, that one didn’t work good. Like, we took the same challenge and we kept launching it and we launched it four times a year. And that’s how it became a really great challenge. So I just want you to like, oh my god, three years to even get like one of those things, right? And so around that, yes, I had, I had a bit of a team, but we were all, all kind of working solo and I was really lonely. And I just, I did not, I didn’t have support around like, I dunno, like when things would go wrong in my business. Like I had my husband, but we can’t count on one person to be everything for us.
LH (24:01):
And we did, we weren’t speaking the same language business wise yet. It just wasn’t a good thing. When I would go to him, like with any stresses or what I should, our creation process was very different. So this was when I actually went to a Jack Canfield event. I was like, I need help. I, I think I wanna start doing other things, but I also need to tribe like, so I had enrolled in a Jack Canfield event. I was also becoming interested in personal development at this time because I realized that in fitness I couldn’t get them to transform if I couldn’t change their mindset. So I wanted to go and learn from people who knew how to do that and, and add it to my program. So this all was happening at once. It was like, okay, this is gonna fix a lot of things for me.
LH (24:45):
That was my hope anyway. And it did. But I ended up going, and simultaneously while I was doing this, he was talking about masterminds and I was like, what’s a mastermind? And he was talking about how he gets together with a group of friends. He did it like weekly or biweekly. And this was this group that would support each other through business and even life. And it was very, it was very planned out. And to me right away I was like, okay, that doesn’t feel like it’s gonna take away from my life. You know, according to like prior experiences where maybe I would try to get something together and the people just weren’t there yet and I was trying to drag them with me and they didn’t wanna go where I was going. I was like, okay, find people who wanna go where you’re going.
LH (25:22):
Create a touch base where you are accountable to them every single week. It did not go, actually we did every other week for one hour, created this with another fitness woman and then another woman that she knew. So a total stranger and then another woman that I had just met. But we all had goals that were similar. We all wanted to grow our business. And that is when I just realized the power of connecting with people. Our businesses all accelerated so fast by doing this. And, and here’s the thing is like, I was serious, so I wanted to create accountability and so did they, like when we first got on our first call, it was like, how serious are we taking this? And it was like, well, I, if you don’t show up, like without an excuse or if you have to travel, like you’re out.
LH (26:06):
Like if you don’t show up or if we go, if you continue to go over or if you come here with a problem but you’re not into it you know, if you, if you’re not willing to find a solution, that’s not why we’re here and we just can’t move forward with you, we’ll find someone else. And so this was like an expectation from the beginning. Well that scared the hell outta me. I was like, oh my God, this is serious. But my vision was so much bigger than my fear because I would pay attention to it daily at this point. I was, I was going on walks or runs or working out and I would specifically choose to visualize what I wanted every single day during those moments of movement. And so my vision was, was just, even, even if it was just 1% bigger than my fear, I kept it bigger than my fear.
LH (26:46):
So really started showing up to that. And that taught me so much about consistency, accountability, who you are around putting it out there, talking through your fears. Like my comeback rate is so much faster when I’m in these groups because it, where where maybe I would be, let’s say somebody tells me like when I was trying to get a a a book deal, right? And they tell me this is real. Your book sucks. Your writing is basic. This idea’s been done a million times. No. Like, no one will buy your book. Okay, well instead of me being like, my book sucks, I shouldn’t put this out there, I’ve already been turned down 20 times, that is a real number. Instead, I got on this call that week with those women and they said to me, are you kidding? Like, this book is amazing. You’re incredible. You’re a great writer. That’s just some, you know, jerk that you literally need to get over and we’re gonna make a plan to get out there again right away. Who’s your next call next day? Get on another call lit. Literally that week because I went right back into it and they made me feel so much better. I got a six figure book deal that week, literally same week where I would’ve not first time author. I would’ve not, I think I would’ve just like walled and given up.
AJV (28:04):
That’s so important because you said three things there that I just like, this is a very big deal. And the first of them comes back as something you already talked about is your environment. Mm-Hmm.
LH (29:00):
Wow.
AJV (29:01):
Four times more likely. And the main reason is they don’t share their failures.
LH (29:08):
Oh
AJV (29:08):
Wow. They don’t share their failures. And so I think the environment is huge. You said the community is huge, but then the third thing is just literally having a support system. Yes. Having people who believe in you is if frigging big deal. Mm-Hmm.
LH (29:24):
AJV (29:26):
Was help you up.
LH (29:27):
Mm-Hmm.
AJV (30:22):
Think this is like a really big deal. Cause I think about all of the people who are in our community at Brand Builders group and I just know that so many of them suffer from, well I have been doing this for like 10 months.
AJV (30:39):
Yeah. And yes. And it’s like, Daisy even hear you say that you were doing the exact same challenge for three years of just going, okay, well that didn’t work. Let’s let’s launch it this way. Okay. That didn’t work. Or show it again. It’s like you were doing it four times a year for three years, 12 times for over three years to go, okay, I think we finally have a formula that works. Mm-Hmm.
LH (31:11):
Yeah.
AJV (31:11):
We were basically stalking these people at this point, but it took two years. We had two years of rejection when we were getting our first book deal. And it’s like people, it takes time. And I love what you said. It’s like, you know, I, again, I wrote this down too. This is gonna show up all over social media in some way so that there’s always a gift in what you just did. Mm. There’s always a gift in what you just did. And it’s like in a huge part is that bounce back factor, that ability to come back and go, okay, well that didn’t work. What’s next? But we gotta have perspective of this. This is a, this is not a sprint, this is a marathon. And it takes time and trial and error and a whole bunch of perseverance. And it’s a whole lot easier to do if you’ve got a whole bunch of people coming along with you on the sidelines.
LH (32:00):
Oh my god. You know what I think of all the time that is, is so crazy because we all watch it every year, is is football, like majority of people like athletics, basketball, golf, like, so I think the reason, I mean, the reason that athletes can number one, get so good and also just like they’re resilient is because they have a team and also they don’t have an expectation around if they fail, they don’t get to quit. There is no quit. Like there’s another game
AJV (33:30):
I think of that,
LH (33:31):
Oh my gosh. With just athletes, they have an expectation of, okay, get back in the game. Like if they suck so bad, like I think of those people who are, who are throwing the, what is it? The, the the free throw or the kickers, right? They don’t get to be like, oh, I sucked and go cry on the sidelines. Even if they just lost something for their whole team or, you know, it was a huge turning. They could have been a huge turning point for their team. They are great and athletes are great because they don’t dwell on the past. They do not dwell on what happened. Their next thought is what’s next? Okay, what can I do next? And I’ve just adopted that. I’ve stopped being willing to look back unless it’s to say, what could I do better? And then I say, what’s next?
AJV (34:17):
That is so good. And that is also so representative in your trajectory through your life and your career of this evolution of all the things that you’ve kind of done. So I wanna kind of pivot just a little bit right now and talk tactically about some of the things that you’ve done. And so I’ve got a few questions outlined that I know are gonna be really important to our audience. So here’s the first one. Keys through your eyes, through your opinion, I don’t care what anyone else says, just through Lori’s eyes, what are the keys to creating courses that both create real value but also generate real revenue?
LH (34:55):
Mm. Well, a few things that I’ve learned is that a good course is only good if people complete it.
AJV (35:03):
LH (35:05):
And a lot of the courses that I created in the beginning I learned really quick and relaunched them. I like segmented them because I came out with like 12 modules, then quickly segmented them to six, like took it down and chunked them up. And then even there we started selling even like individual things like individual modules. So with that said, you know, we can think that we’re perfecting it by adding more, but I think we’re in an era of less is more. And to make the number one thing I want people to feel when they go into a course is accomplished. Mm-Hmm.
AJV (36:16):
They’re true.
LH (36:17):
Because those work, they just do show up, do the work, make yourself feel better, work out, eat well, repeat, do it again,
AJV (36:28):
It’s so true.
LH (36:30):
And so yeah,
AJV (36:31):
Go ahead. That point of less is more. It’s like my number one complaint with like, pretty much every single course that I purchase is I get in and I’m like, I don’t have time for this right now. Totally. Cause I get in and I’m like, oh my gosh, there’s 14 modules I I don’t even care about. If they’re one minute each, I can’t even get that far. I’m like, huh. Cause I wanna be able to like do an entire course in one sitting.
LH (36:54):
Yep.
AJV (36:54):
That’s how I roll. And so if it’s, if I can’t do it, I’m like, oh, now I have to schedule it. And then that just never happens. So I love about the concept of less is more. I would pay more money to get the information in a more consolidated version. And that’s what I hear you saying.
LH (37:09):
Totally. And people do pay that for different things, right? Like how many I was just thinking about the book or the, the audibles that take books and they chunk them down and you pay for essentially the cliff notes of the books. And I was like, see, I will buy more of those, spend more money so that you can just tell me what the book’s gonna tell me right away.
AJV (37:34):
Well it’s a, it’s a whole thing. Like we talk about this all the time when we talk about the keynote business and you know, we’ve been in the keynote business for a really long time and I remember earlier in our career, I remember so many people saying, you charge that for an hour. And the answer is no. You get 15 years of consolidation and experience in trial and error and knowledge and research and hundreds of thousands of dollars spent. You get all of that in an hour. That’s what you’re getting. It’s not an hour rate. It’s no, you’re getting 20 years of stuff primed into an hour. So you don’t have to go through all of that. That’s what you
LH (38:19):
Oh my gosh. Totally. Like literally it was just in a mastermind that was four days long and lots of hours for me to come back with three things that I’ve given to people and they’re like, shut up. This blew my mind. And I’m like, you’re welcome for sitting in there for four hours and traveling and spending all that money.
AJV (38:36):
So glad it cost you, cost you five.
LH (38:38):
Yes. Could now could you go and bring something back to me?
AJV (38:41):
LH (39:00):
Mm-Hmm.
LH (39:43):
Like just sit for a day and say, what are three key things that have changed my life on this journey? And from those key things, you can literally tell a story for each one, each. So break ’em down. You have three things in front of you. Tell a story for each one. Extract the lesson, have them maybe do some writing around it. Like it’s that simple. Like that is what people need is just that moment of like, oh, if I did this, this would really change the game for me and move the needle. How can I implement it? How can I integrate it? And when
AJV (40:16):
Yeah. You know, it’s that whole concept of save the best for first
AJV (40:22):
LH (41:13):
Yeah. I love that you even shared that as I’m like thinking about just different things in the future. I’m like, gosh, why don’t, I mean that’s such a great even marketing idea to be like, look, our conference is one day and we’re just gonna have more of them, or whatever that looks like because we want you to take something from this day and go integrate it like that. Same with courses that we just talked about. Yeah. How can you think of it in a, a different way of like how your people learn best or what do they need most to do? Like is it just the one thing and then go integrate it? Like how could you build it so that it works better for them?
AJV (41:44):
I mean, every, every audience, every community is different, but mm-hmm.
LH (41:56):
That’s
AJV (41:56):
So good. It’s like 30% of the time is learning, 70% of the time is doing. And we do it with you because selfishly that’s how we do it. It’s like that’s, I learn we need, that’s how we learn. And it’s like we can’t be the only ones go home at the end of a a mastermind event going, oh, when am I gonna have time to even look at these notes? Versus no, we’re gonna do those notes in session together. So I love that Less is more help ’em feel accomplished quickly. Give ’em the best goods right up front. Change their life in the first hour. That’s amazing. So, okay. I’m gonna, I’m just like, I’m gonna go rapid fire. I love it. I don’t wanna miss any of these. Ok so next one. You know, I’m sure this is going to be such an easy answer, but how do you get 46 million downloads on your podcast?
LH (42:44):
Oh God. How
AJV (42:45):
Do you do this?
LH (42:46):
You know what, I think it was consistency, like consistently showing up and I talk about it everywhere I go. So at every speaking thing I’ve ever done, I’m pretty sure I’ve mentioned it at everything or weaved in like, you know, I’ve had this many interviews and this is what it’s taught me. I talk about it on social media every day. I you know, started a a a text list where I’ll also text you a reminder like, listen to this episode if you’re feeling this way. In the beginning I definitely feel like it was important to do a good launch. And that’s what I focused on. So, you know, if you’re thinking of launching a podcast, I think having a good launch strategy strategy, and I’ll share just a tiny, a couple tiny things around that. If you can speak anywhere when you’re launching, that would be awesome.
LH (43:36):
Or if you can have an event, because I think one of the main things that got me onto new and noteworthy is I was holding a Bliss Project event and I didn’t even really realize what I had done in a, in a good way. So take this and plan it better than I did. But I, I had that event and it had like four to 500 women at it. And what I did is I literally asked them, cause I launched the podcast that week, knowing the event was there, but I said, can you take out your phones and subscribe and leave a review now? And I think all of those going at once, you know, helped it stay up in new and noteworthy. And then I also continued to ask through the event, I’m like, Hey, you know, I spent all this time in front of this microphone because I wanna give you like the, the best stuff.
LH (44:18):
It’s truly like the, the things that have changed my life. If it changes your life or if you like it, would you share it? Would you just remember to share it? And on the podcast, I ask on just about every episode share this with someone. Like you get now to be, even if you’re not the person giving me advice, like you get, like when I share podcasts, I get to be the hero. And I say that like, I’m the hero. I just shared this awesome information. Be the hero. Share this information. Would you share this? Would you rate and review this? People will not do what they’re not asked to do. So I consistently, specifically ask for what I want on every single podcast. You guys am almost a thousand episodes in, that’s over a thousand asks. So it’s, it’s definitely going to help spread obviously when you do that
AJV (45:09):
Well. Yeah, it’s like if you don’t ask, the answer is always no.
LH (45:13):
Yes. Ask so
AJV (45:15):
Good. That’s just, I mean, simple, but again, the fundamentals work.
LH (45:21):
Mm-Hmm.
AJV (45:22):
LH (45:55):
Yes. Oh my gosh. Okay. So for me it was really what is the next challenge? And I felt like I had really done. So I was at that place where that realization where I did not, I did not dream past where I was like, I, I became the author, the the speaker. I had done the things and I was like, I never let myself dream outside of this. This was the cap. And I hit that place in like 2018 and I was like, I don’t think I wanna write another book right now. That was a really long journey. And I, I was feeling, you know, as you can tell from my journey, I’m a bit of a squirrel brain. So I was like, I need, I wanted a new challenge and I was craving a challenge that would force me to become a different person in order to fulfill it.
LH (46:45):
And I also was having a lot of conversations with my husband and started going to dinner with Chris and his friends. And I was noticing this stark difference in conversations. I was so lit up. Not that I wasn’t lit up with my friends, but at the, the place that I was, we were kind of having the same conversations about how do we get our courses out? How do we, you know, all of those, which is amazing, but I, I was having them and my brain likes new things often this know that thy self, right? And so I was going to dinner with my husband and they were having conversations about investing in companies, investing in each other’s companies how to really start pulling in lots of money, hundreds of millions of dollars, if not some of them talking about billions. And this was blowing my mind.
LH (47:32):
I was just like, they’re having this like a normal conversation. Like it because people had exited for 300 million and this guy for 500 million. And I was like, whoa, whoa, whoa. My girlfriends are not having this conversation right now. They’re burnt out and they’re trying to figure out how to launch their next course, which is amazing. But also, what if this was an opportunity for them because they had already built their brands. I was sitting here thinking, okay, these women could, like, immediately I was thinking of all the ways they could implement and help grow these things. Cause I’m like, they have the audiences and you guys are looking for the audiences. Yeah. So we were just missing how to raise money, how to invest in each other, how to start a company. And so I was starting to feel this really big call. I was like, no, no, no, no, no, God, not me.
LH (48:15):
No, why. But I was feeling it like, oh, it’s gonna be you who’s gonna bring this back to your friends? And I was like, oh, crap. So I just literally got that soul hit and it was like, oh gosh, I am on this journey. Learned how to raise money, started learning about physical products. So, so similar, yet so different. So the really cool thing about a personal brand is that if you can start learning about physical products, you have so much of the equation already done that a lot of people who might be good at physical products don’t necessarily know how to do yet. So if these two worlds could collide, it’d be like, it’s mind blowing, right? Because you have both Hals of what you need. You need the marketing, which is like very much of what you’re learning in a personal brand is like how to market yourself.
LH (49:06):
All you’re doing is you’re taking marketing yourself and you’re gonna now market a product that technically is you. If you build it the way that I told you throughout your core values, it’s just something that you do and use, right? So it’s kind of, it’s kind of the same thing. And now people are really buying the core values and the founder and all of those things behind the products, which I think is really cool. So things that you want to know about building a product, find somebody who has done what you have done before. Do not go into this just Googling. Like you have to start by Googling, but then you need to sit down with as many people as you can and say, what do I need to know? What do I need to look out for? I would say start with a product that feels really natural to you.
LH (49:50):
Like a, a need that you see, or that you, you can see the world needing out there. Like a white space. Look for what the differentiator is. Why, why is it different from all of the other products out there? Why is it better? Why are you the person and that your team who can market it the best? I would stay away from your first products for anything that has a lot of legal tape around it. Anything that is really regulated, you, you’re gonna spend this is no joke. You will spend 10 times more on legal fees. There’ll be a lot more things that you cannot do when you are marketing online, when you’re marketing in retail. So it really stops a lot of the organic things that you can do, especially if you have already built a brand. It, it’ll even kind of stop you from being able to use what you already have.
LH (50:38):
So with that said, I would stay away from things that have a lot of like red tape or regulations. Okay. So finding that thing that maybe, and I would focus on one, I would focus on one product so that all of that money in r and d and research and all of the copywriting and everything, you can put all of your money behind that one message and you can tweak that
LH (51:23):
So it’s a lot of energy and it’s a much bigger team. So I would say start with one thing. Start with something that you can see needs to be improved out in the marketplace. And from there, honestly it’s, I don’t wanna say it’s easy, but you just have to have meetings with formulators co packers and you’ll learn all of these things along the way. Cause it’ll be how to make a lipstick and market it out to the world or put it on retail. You’ll get all of your answers, I promise you. And then from there, you’ll wanna talk to people and research people who have done it.
AJV (51:53):
Oh, those are so good. And I, I love what you said too about just avoid any sort of thing that has lots of legal tape because you’ll spend all of your investment money voyers.
LH (52:04):
Yes.
AJV (52:04):
So avoiding those sorts of things, it’s just an easier, easier, not easy, easier mm-hmm.
AJV (52:23):
Before I ask you this last question. For all of you who are listening, I as before we started the recording, I said, Hey, where do you want me to send people who wanna connect with you? Because if you have listened to this interview and your mind is not blown with the amount of information that you have gotten, then you need to go back and listen again. We’re clearly spaced out. Like there is so much richness, there is so much gold in this interview. You don’t even know what you’re listening to because I, I just know how much time, money, resources, education that you have gone through to be able to quickly spit out some of these things that we all get on a free podcast. And so if you want more of that, which I think you do, I think you should probably tune into this. Lori has a really cool daily text that if you just text the word daily to this number, which is 3 1 0 4 9 6 8 3 6 3. So again, text the word daily to 3 1 0 4 9 6 8 3 6 3. Now don’t worry, I will also put that in the show notes. You can grab that. But you are gonna get a daily text from her. So Lori, tell ’em really quickly what this is all about.
LH (53:48):
Oh my goodness. Well, thank you for sharing this. I, this is actually the spot where I create all content from. So you kind of get like the real me sitting down and talking to like a best friend. And these are the conversations or the, the, the quotes or the nuggets that I’m getting from masterminds or things that are really pushing me forward. Or maybe there’s a block and then there’s a thought around the block that helps push it forward. These are some, you know, different things that Chris and I do to really like, keep our, our vision in front of us. These are different affirmations that are rocking my world. These are just like, if I was your bestie and I was sending you like cheerleader texts every single day, like truly from my heart and from here, that is where I, because I sit and I write from my heart, truly. Like, okay, if this was my best friend, what would I be sending her right now? And from there, that’s where I kind of create all other content. So you get the first videos, you get the first texts, all of those things. So I will only spam you with things that will change your life.
AJV (54:52):
LH (55:27):
Oh God. Go, go to the scarier places first. Like at, go to the, do whatever you can to knock down the doors of the people who have done it and ask the go learn from them and ask them questions. Like join their stuff. Ask for one on one time. Like they will, everything that we have said on here, they will accelerate your journey. They will save you money. They will save you heartache. Make sure they’ve done what you wanna do.
AJV (56:18):
Oh my gosh, this is such a good reminder. I says, don’t do it alone. Mm-Hmm.
LH (56:46):
I gotta live. I gotta live there too. I want to.
AJV (56:50):
Y’all, this has been so good and I’m a quick learner. I take advice. Well, so if you got value from this podcast, please share it. Please, please go like it, leave a review, please share it with someone that you think it’s going to be helpful for. Be the hero, get this content out in the world. So and then go do the same, right. Quick learner. Mm-Hmm.
LH (57:31):
Bye.
Ep 337: How to Convert Your Speaking Business into Lifelong Clients with Matt Mayberry | Recap Episode
RV (00:07):
Hey brand builder, Rory Vaden here. Thank you so much for taking the time to check out this interview as always, it’s our honor to provide it to you for free and wanted to let you know there’s no big sales pitch or anything coming at the end. However, if you are someone who is looking to build and monetize your personal brand, we would love to talk to you and get to know you a little bit and hear about some of your dreams and visions and share with you a little bit about what we’re up to to see if we might be a fit. So if you’re interested in a free strategy call with someone from our team, we would love to hear from you. You can do that at brand builders, group.com/pod call brand builders, group.com/pod call. We hope to talk to you soon.
AJV (00:54):
Hey, all, welcome to the recap episode on my conversation with the lovely Matt Mayberry. I just love my conversations with him. He’s so humble and he’s so helpful. I thought this was a great conversation, and so I’ve broken it down to my three main takeaways and I say three, but they’re kind of like all jumbled into like one main takeaway. So here’s like this kind of like overarching theme that I got from a conversation with Matt. And I don’t know why I had this like interesting aha moment during this conversation. But I loved what he said when he said that his definition of culture is just behavior at scale. And it got me thinking that for a company, we talk a ton about culture, but for an individual, the same goes for reputation. And then I started thinking about this concept of a reputation is to an individual, what culture is to accompany, right?
AJV (02:05):
Because both of the things are, what do you want people to feel or to think when they experience you? Right? So we’ve all been a part of different customer service experiences where you’re like, man, like that was amazing. We’re like, man, how are you even business? Right? How, how do you operate like this? And you know, it’s like, I’m not gonna say that people haven’t said that about us. Like we’re not perfect, but there is a culture in the way that people treat each other treat leadership, leadership, treats, leadership, leadership treats employees, how we treat our clients that the interactions like that’s a feeling, right? Those aren’t words on a page or pictures that it’s a, it’s a feeling I I’ve walked into offices before buildings before where it’s like, you could feel the culture that was there, right. Walking into a no offense, a holiday in express versus walking into a Rosewood property has a very different feeling and culture that emanates.
AJV (03:10):
And I don’t just mean due to the element of how nice things are, but it’s, it’s a feeling, right? You get the same thing. If you’re on the phone with somebody like the energy just emanates from them, the same thing happens with you and your reputation, your personal brand, as it does with a company. The difference is as an individual, my reputation, my personal brand is about me and for a company. It’s the culture, right? What we’re trying to do is we’re trying to create this feeling. And this experience that people go through as a part of being a part of this company as a client or as a, a team member, but as a, an individual, a personal brand, we do the same thing and it has to be curated and it has to have intention. And there are countless countless books, classes, seminar coaches, consultant, speakers that could go on and on and on about how to create company culture.
AJV (04:16):
But where are the books, classes, coaches, seminars, consultant, speakers, about how to create your reputation, right? And that’s what we do at brand builders group. That’s what we’re passionate about. That’s what our uniqueness is. We lived in corporate consulting for 15 years, working with leaders about company culture and employees in retention and performance. And now we work with individuals about how do you do the same thing for yourself, which is your reputation, right? And the intentional creation of your reputation is your personal brand, right? So your personal brand is to an individual, what company culture is to an organization. And that’s how I really want you to think about this. If we go, it’s like, man, as, as, as leaders, we spend tons of time talking about culture and core values. Are we spending the same amount of time of going, what do I want to be known for who do I want to be known by?
AJV (05:22):
And then how do I become known for those things by those people that is personal branding and it needs, and it requires the same amount of focus and intention as it does to create a culture within an organization. Right? And I just, I just loved that just concept and a parallel of reputation and personal branding is to an individual is what company culture is to an organization. So it’s kind of like the broad overarching takeaway from me and that and then I, I wrote this down and I literally was like, man, that’s really important of just going your culture. Isn’t your core values, these aren’t words and definitions on a website or a flyer that you hand held a new, higher onboarding. But a culture are the daily behaviors that happen when the leader isn’t around. And so if you are a leader, right, and when I say a leader, I mean a parent, I mean a volunteer, I mean an employee, an employer, an entrepreneur, I mean anyone like what are the behaviors that need to happen on a daily basis to create the culture that you want?
AJV (06:49):
And then for an individual, what are the daily behaviors that need to happen for you to establish the reputation that you want? Have you thought about that? And if not, this is the time to do that. Like literally pause this recap right now, give yourself five minutes and go, what is the reputation I wanna have? What do I want people to think of when they think of me? And in order for that to happen, what are the three to five behaviors that I have to display on a daily basis to create that consistency. So that people associate me with what I want to be associated with and then do the same thing for your company. It’s like, what are the behaviors that need to happen with your executives, with your leaders, with your managers, with your employees in order for this culture to be curated and lived out on a daily basis, culture and reputation are the end result of daily behaviors.
AJV (08:02):
And we spend a lot of time talking about end results, and we need to talk about what are the daily behaviors that have to happen consistently to give us that end result. And then the last thing that I wrote down and I think again, just paying attention to all the things that I need to do as a leader, as an entrepreneur. But also
AJV (09:26):
So what’s your story and how are you using that to build your company culture, to build your personal reputation, to build your personal brand. What’s that story that what’s that defining story of your life that it’s like, this is a piece of what made me and here’s what I learned from it. And here’s what you, stranger friend, family member can learn from this. This is how you can apply something that I’ve learned from something that I went through and actually take it and apply it to your own life. Because here’s what I know at the end of the day. If you give me a whole bunch of words and acronyms and steps, I might retain some of it. But if you tell me a story how remember most of it. So what’s that story that makes you so unique that it sets you apart. So again, I would encourage you to pause right now, don’t put this on your to-do list.
AJV (10:25):
Don’t set a time to do it a month from now, which will never happen right now. Give yourself permission to take three to five minutes and just go, what are the stories that have shaped me? What are the stories that other people can relate to that? By sharing this piece of my story would help someone else that there’s a lesson to be learned from my employees, from my audience, from my clients, from my family. But what is this story that makes you, you y’all such a good interview. Go listen to it, take the time. Do these two quick exercises. I promise you, I took the time before doing this and I did it for myself. It makes a difference, but you’ve gotta have the intention before you actually create the plan. So take the time, create that intention and then go make the plan. We’ll see you next time.
Ep 336: How to Convert Your Speaking Business into Lifelong Clients with Matt Mayberry
RV (00:07):
Hey brand builder, Rory Vaden here. Thank you so much for taking the time to check out this interview as always, it’s our honor to provide it to you for free and wanted to let you know there’s no big sales pitch or anything coming, uh, at the end. However, if you are someone who is looking to build and monetize your personal brand, we would love to talk to you and get to know you a little bit and hear about some of your dreams and visions and share with you a little bit about what we’re up to to see if we might be a fit. So if you’re interested in a free strategy call with someone from our team, we would love to hear from you. You can do that at brand builders, group.com/pod call brand builders, group.com/pod call. We hope to talk to you soon.
AJV (00:53):
Hey everybody, this is AJ Vaden. I am one of your co-host on the influential personal brand podcast. And I’m so excited about my guest today, because not only is he an amazing expert guest, he’s also a personal friend. And as someone who’s been helping me out a lot this year with some of my own goals, which maybe you’ll get to hear a little bit about in this interview, but before we get into it, I wanna tell you why you need to stick around and listen to this interview, right? So here are three things that you want to know that should entice you to wanna stick around and listen to what Matt Mayberry has to say. Number one, we’re gonna talk about how to use all the things that you’ve gone through in your life and how you can actually use those to help you leverage success and influence in whatever you’re doing right now.
AJV (01:45):
Now, I think this is really important because for most of us, there are things that we have gone through in our lives that we don’t actually talk about, but it’s those things that endear people to us. It’s those things that help us build trust, whether it’s with clients or employees or with friends and family. And by just simply embracing those things and sharing them, they not only help you build trust in the marketplace, but they actually help you build your business. So that’s number one. Uh, number two, you wanna stick around if you have any desire now or later in the future to write a book or write a second book, um, to speak consult, train, uh, right. For, uh, very, very well known publications. If any of those things are going, like, how’d you get into that? You wanna stick around for this interview and then last but not least if you or somebody who has gone through are going through or who inevitably will go through as serious life or, or career transition.
AJV (02:45):
And you’re wondering like, what do I do next? This is an interview that was literally curated for you. So that’s why you wanna sticker out. And we’re gonna cover all of that. I’m like 50 minutes. So it’s gonna be, be jampacked now without further. Anddo let me give you just a little bit of background on my very special guest, Mr. Matt Mayberry. So Matt is an internationally acclaimed keynote speaker. He does leadership development. He speaks on culture change, organizational performance. He’s actually been named one of the top 30 leadership thought leaders in the world. Like that’s huge, not in America in the world. His insights have been on all of the big name brands, Forbes, Fox news business, insider NBC at ESPN. Let here learn a little bit about his background with that. Um, but more than that, like he works for huge global corporations like Phillips 66, Allstate, JP Morgan chase, uh, fifth, third bank, the FBI, like even the FBI is hiring this guy. So y’all like, give it up for Mr. Matt Mayberry. I am so excited to have you, Matt. Thank you so much for being on the show today.
MM (03:58):
Hey AJ, thank you so much for having me I’m really excited for today.
AJV (04:01):
Yeah. And so here’s, so here’s what I wanna start. Cause I know that, um, many people all around the world know who you are, but there might be many people in our audience who are getting to meet you for the very first time. And I know that even in this question, I’m going to learn things about you that I did not know before this call today. So here’s where I’d like to start is just, how did you go from where you were? Right. And it’s like, I know I have the privilege of knowing that you had this opportunity to play in the NFL, right? But even prior to the NFL, you had a lot of life events leading you on a certain path and a trajectory then that got you to the NFL. Right? And I’d love for you to talk about the path to the NFL, but then you took a really stark pivot, a career change into what you’re doing now. And I’d love to know is just like, give us a little bit of your background. What got you to the NFL and then what happened there? And then tell us a little bit about what you’re doing now.
MM (05:00):
Yeah, absolutely. Thanks AJ. You know, I, I think for me, my journey to help, you know, give some context and clarity for everybody. I, I think that anytime you hear, you know, former professional athlete or even former collegiate athlete at a very high level playing division one, you know, whether that’s football or basketball, I think the first assumption is that that individual was destined from a early age that they were gonna be a professional athlete in the next LeBron James, or, you know, Brian Och or Ray Lewis. For me, that wasn’t the case. I, I, I certainly was a gifted athlete, but really starting at the age of 14 years old, I started hanging around with the wrong crowd. Um, you know, I grew up in Dar Illinois, which is a suburb of Chicago, which I live in downtown Chicago right now. But for me, my life starting really from that age on all the way up to I was, you know, really 17, 18 years old was a full blown out drug addict, two near death experiences.
MM (05:51):
My own mother, the woman that brought me into this world that I love so much has seen me do cocaine five times with her own two eyes, uh, broke my father’s ribs on multiple occasions when he would confront me about why I was coming home past curfew and, and really my best sport growing up, believe it or not was baseball. A lot of people thought that I would be drafted straight outta high school, skip college and go play in the major leagues. But I got kicked off my baseball team cuz I got caught stealing one of my teammates wallet it’s one afternoon while the rest of my team was out, you know, at practice I stayed behind because when everyone was getting dressed, I saw all this cash that was sitting in one of my teammates, wallets. And I, I stole that money cause I thought about all the drugs that I could buy and the rest is history.
MM (06:33):
I got kicked off my baseball team, uh, and, and things were really bad for me in that point in my life, uh, so much so that my high school was gonna expel me. If I didn’t go to a drug treatment facility for at least one month. And even though me or my parents or, you know, people closest to me, never thought that I would be a professional athlete, even though that people around us would always say that I had the potential to one day be that I certainly had a lot of opportunities from the high school administration because I was a gifted athlete. Uh, for example, I probably got more opportunities. Uh, second chances, third chances, fourth chances that maybe the next person wouldn’t have gotten because I did have that talent. Uh, quite frankly, they should have expelled me right then and there, you know, it, it shouldn’t have been an ultimatum where, Hey, Matt, go to this drug team facility for one month.
MM (07:22):
We’re gonna give you an opportunity to get sober and get your life in order. And maybe, maybe you’ll be able to come back to school and you still have football, right? So you can utilize that. And, and for me that was a turning point in my life because, you know, I always say that, you know, an individual can change their life. In one of two ways, they can either get inspired by some monumental event. They can get inspired by the, uh, hustle and bustle of life. They can get inspired by an audacious goal or dream that they have that’s near and dear to their heart, or they can change their life out of desperation. And for me it was desperation. Uh, this for me was really my turning point where I didn’t wanna put any more tears in my mother’s face. I, I didn’t want to experience another near death moment where my mother, father, younger brother and all my aunts and uncles and cousins were gonna be in the hospital room, thought that they were gonna lose their son, their cousin, their brother, that particular day.
MM (08:18):
And I, I remember very vividly when I went to that drug treatment facility. You know, I didn’t go to change my life, but I, I I’ll never forget the moment that changed at all. It was, I never believed any epiphanies or moments in time that could drastically alter one’s life until that moment and experience. And I came home and had the opportunity to eat dinner with my family one evening. And I has to be excused after maybe 15 minutes of sitting down at the dinner table and I went to take a shower. But the turning point for me was when I had the strength and courage for the first time, really in three years, at that point in my life to look myself directly in the mirror, I looked back and, and I, I saw just what a terrible human being. I was all the hurt that I caused and my family members, my friends, the people closest to me, my grandparents who loved me so much.
MM (09:05):
And, and for me that moment, I, I still remember it to this day. And I got goosebumps on my arms right now, talking about it, you know, for me that was the turning point that changed at all. Hmm. And I, I never believed in moments in time or epiphanies that can, that can just change it all for one person. Right. I always thought it was an accumulation of events. And for me, it was obviously there was a lot riding on that one particular moment, but it was that moment of looking myself directly in the mirror and seeing what a Demonn and terrible miserable life I was leading that really just made me go back into my room and say, okay, thi this isn’t how I wanna live the rest of my life. And I, I guess you could say from there, the rest is history.
MM (09:43):
I still had football. So I made a major goal of, I, I want to get a division one college scholarship. I want to have new friends. I wanna get rid of my drug friends. I, I quit the drug cold Turkey, continued through the drug treatment program, got faster, uh, went to college football camps. I, I think one particular summer before my, my senior year, I think I went to over 45 colleges, uh, where my father drove me all across the country, just going to their camps, meeting the different coaches. Wow. And I ended up going to Indiana, had a great career there. And then obviously I had an opportunity to play for the hometown team, the Chicago bears, uh, which I did not have the eight year, nine year NFL career that I had hoped for. And at this point it was a monumental event for me in my life because here’s the hometown kid, drug addict, overcame, you know, that period of his life, hometown, newspaper.
MM (10:37):
I mean, all my friends, family, everyone ate it up. But for me, I got hurt in a pre-season game. And what was projected was which in my eyes, I thought I was gonna have this very long fruitful career. I was gonna set my family up for success. One game, one dream, completely shattered in, in one, one moment. Uh, I was not able to come back from that injury, playing the San Diego chargers out in San Diego, California. And for me, that was my career. Um, and
AJV (11:53):
Yeah. I mean, wow. Like that’s so crazy. Like we could spend the rest of our time today, just talking about that little part of your story. Um, but there’s two things about your story that I think are really applicable to our audience that I wanna kind of like talk about is one you’re pretty open and vulnerable and transparent about all these different things in your life. And I actually, I believe that’s probably one of the things that makes you so sought after is that it’s not about all of your successes. It’s about all the things that you’ve gone through, Phil, the failures and the successes. Right. Um, that really make you so personable and relatable. And so I’m just kind of curious for you cuz I know being in this industry and honestly just being a human being, most people don’t wanna talk about all the things that didn’t go well.
AJV (12:47):
Um, because we all have them, right. I have a whole dark closet of dirty secrets that it’s not awesome to like put out there. Right. But at the same time, that really is what makes us who we are. And so I would just love to hear from you, it’s like how much of your story do you build into everything that you talk about? Why is that important to you and why do you think that helps people when they’re building their career to actually cover all the story? Not just the parts that make you look really good.
MM (13:20):
You know, that’s a fantastic question, AJ. I think for me, I had to learn the hard way. You know what I mean by that is when I did get injured in the NFL and I got asked to speak at a leadership event, you know, I, I didn’t have the really desire to do the work that I’m doing now. It wasn’t like I wrote this down on a piece of paper and said, Hey, when I’m done playing football, this is exactly what I want to do. Um, you know, for me, I got asked to speak at an event and really for the first two years of me speaking, when I knew that football wasn’t really gonna be a part of my journey moving forward, I didn’t talk about the things that I just shared. And I’ll never forget a moment where I had a mentor who knew my story kind of knew what I overcame from an early age.
MM (14:01):
And he said, why don’t you ever talk more about your struggles and all the challenges and obstacles that you had to overcome throughout the course of your life? And I said, why would I share that? Why would I share the, the, the, the darkest and deepest secrets that really only my friends and, and closest relatives knew and the, the people that were a part of that journey? Why, why, why would I talk about that stuff? And he said, watch what happens when you do mm-hmm
MM (14:45):
And I shared my whole story. And I think for the very first time at that point for two years, I was speaking, it was one of the first times I’ve ever seen really a whole entire ballroom full of tears. And afterwards I saw the transformative effect of me sharing my story and me Bo being vulnerable as a man and, and really saying, Hey, you know, our deepest and darkest secret sometime can really be the gateway of discovery and purpose and fulfillment and passion for other people in the audience. And, you know, turning point could, because from that moment, I started to really adopt that approach of sharing more of my story, sharing more of myself. And now I know that no one wants to hear my successes and my successes are relatively small to everybody else in this space. And I, I think the big thing that does separate me is my story, my DNA of how I got to where I am, because those are the characteristics that really make me who I am. And every single person that is listening to this podcast or in the audience of a speech, even if you’re not a drug addict, everyone’s gonna lose a loved one. Everyone is, you know, experiences, divorce goes through a difficulty we’ve all experienced the past three years with COVID 19. So everybody can relate to overcoming challenges and how you coped with that. So that that’s really what I took away from being vulnerable in sharing my story, AJ.
AJV (16:08):
I mean, I think that’s really, really important just to touch on again for anyone who’s listening. Um, and I just, I love what you said. It’s like, and I, I love your humility too. It’s like, actually you have pretty awesome accolades, Matt. But with that said, everyone has some sort of professional accreditation or award or something that we can talk about what we’ve done. That doesn’t really differentiate us. What really differentiates us are those unique stories that no one else has, even though they might be similar. Right? So, um, actually my best friend, my high school, best friend childhood best, friend’s been my best friend for almost 30 years, just recently got out of a 90 day, uh, rehab program. And your rehab story is very different than hers, but the point is like, it doesn’t matter what we go through. It’s like, it’s our unique take the lens in which we made it through the struggle that other people latch onto that, you know, they are like, man, it’s like, I just needed to know someone else has been there.
AJV (17:18):
I just needed to know I’m not alone and feeling this way or going through what I’m going through. And it’s like, that’s really what people need more than. Let me tell you about the, you know, MBA, CSP, CPA, all the things behind our names, cuz that doesn’t really tell a story. It doesn’t really create any sort of trust or engagement as much as man. Let me just tell you my story. Let me just tell you what I’ve been through. And so my question to you and to anyone who’s listening, what I really want you to hear is how do you decide what parts of your story to include, where to include them, how to include them. And I ask for
MM (18:35):
Another great question. I, I think, you know, and again, I had to learn the hard way when I first started, it was kind of me getting on stage. And even though I was telling maybe in an emotionally charged and powerful message, it still was really about, let me tell you about Matt Mayberry mm-hmm
MM (19:20):
So before every speaking engagement, let’s say, you know, I don’t just have two or three calls with the event, organizers. I try to have five or seven, uh, to where I’m talking to different members. I’m talking to not only the organizers that are planning that, but I want to talk to some of the attendees. I want to be able to walk in their shoes and know their challenges and kind of what they’re going through. And then I take that back and really integrate bits and pieces of that into my story. But for me, even when I’m telling my story, whether it’s overcoming the drug addiction, whether it’s getting hurt in the NFL, it’s not just me sharing you about Matt Mayberry’s journey. It’s about using that learning experience in my journey to drive home, drive home a relatable point that is really hopefully gonna be an actionable takeaway to improve their leadership or their organization or their culture or their team. So for me, that revolution probably started eight years ago, very early on when I was like, I’m just speaking about myself, even though I, I think I’m relating to people a little bit more than I was, I need to shift some things around. So for me, I, I, I think the biggest piece of advice is you have to be relentless, almost obsessive with, it’s not about you. And I know everybody says that, but you would be very, very shocked at how very few speakers actually are obsessive,
AJV (20:36):
Not shocked at all.
MM (20:37):
AJV (21:04):
I mean, I tried not to be so obvious when my mouth fell open. When you said five to seven calls, cuz it’s like, we always do a pre-event call, but I don’t think we’ve ever done five, six or seven. Like that’s extraordinary. Talk about feeling prepared and knowing the audience that you’re stepping into.
MM (21:24):
Well, it wasn’t always like that though. AJ
AJV (21:26):
MM (21:29):
Amazing. You know, for me, I think that is the, the is the consultant inside of me. And I’m sure we’ll talk a little bit about that. But I think for me, uh, the key noting at consulting kind of simultaneously feed off one another. So, but really on the keying in just the speaking side of it, if I’m just delivering a 60 minute speech, I, I think over the years, probably the past five years, the, the consultant inside of me is really cultivated where I apply that same, you know, mindset and focus to all the keynote work. So it wasn’t always like that. But within the past five years, I’ve really gotten aggressive with that.
AJV (22:02):
Yeah. Well, I would love to know just because I, we do have such a strong community of people who identify as coaches, trainers, consultants, speakers, what do you do on these five to seven calls? Like, are they all the same kind of outline with just different people or what do you do on five calls?
MM (22:19):
You know, it’s it’s so it’s it’s first, the first two to three calls will be with the event. Organizers. I want to have a very firm understanding of what the event’s for, why they’re having it, what they did last year do is this an event that they have annually? Is it quarterly? I’m really getting a basic understanding. You can do that typically in one call, but I kind of like to, you’ll be very surprised if you ask the same questions in call number two, they’re gonna give you a completely different answer almost. So I, I typically like to start there with the two calls and then from there it’s meeting with different leaders of the organization. So if I’m talking with, let’s say the CEO and CEO and CFO for one of the calls call number four, five will actually be with frontline managers who are gonna be in the audience for that particular event.
MM (23:04):
Because even though the CEO and COO maybe is telling me one thing, maybe the frontline managers have a completely different challenge that senior executives don’t even have a clue about. So for me, it’s being very and thoroughly prepared about, uh, really, really, really deeply understanding what is success to them because every pre-call is gonna entail. These are our objectives, this is why we’re having the event. But if, if you take it a step further and really push for, how do you want your audience to feel when Matt Mayberry steps off stage, what do you want them to do? And what do you want them to think about? Just those three questions is a complete game changer and really gives me a framework to kind of take back and into my preparation to really deliver a speech that is very tailored for that particular audience.
AJV (23:57):
That’s so good. And I think, you know, like the big takeaway that I just hear and what you’re saying is that you have to get to know your audience and that doesn’t matter if you’re a speaker consultant executive. It’s like if you’re, you know, an employer, right, your audience is your employees. I think that’s a really great reminder for this very interesting time
MM (24:27):
Absolutely. And I learned that very on, you know, because people do have more inspiring stories than me. Uh, there are people who have way more business experience than me. There’s plenty of people who run more successful businesses than me. So I had to realize, you know, what is my uniqueness? What is my uniqueness? And how can I exploit that, uh, in the service of others is which I heard that first from your husband, uh, RO Vaden, the great RO Vaden
AJV (25:23):
And I love that. It’s like, it doesn’t matter what you do, it’s figuring out what your uniqueness is and then leveraging that to differentiate yourself. Like, I mean, that’s the heart of like what people are looking for to begin with. It’s like, what makes you different from the speaker last year or from, you know, the consultant next year or whatever. It’s like, what’s that it factor that makes you you, right. I love that. And I actually, I think it’s so awesome that you do so many calls and you know, like what I heard in the back of my head is like, man, this is really good sales and marketing, right? It’s like, you’re building relationships with these people. You’re getting to know their culture, right. You’re just, you’re prepping up for, how can I stay integrated into this company, into this organization long after I perform a keynote on stage
MM (26:09):
And you, I mean, that’s really it, AJ. I, I, I think this now at this point in my career, I mean, that’s really a, a keynote for me if I’m doing a keynote, uh, the, the purpose of that keynote. I mean, obviously I get compensated very well for my time delivering a keynote. I love it. I love the energy. Uh, but at the end of the day, it really is that gateway to open a relationship for deeper, more ongoing work where now, I mean, some of my clients, we’re going on four years of, of wor working and partnering together. So for me, it’s not just to have a call to understand the audience it’s to truly set that relationship open, to continually add more value and maybe even over deliver than what they’re expecting.
AJV (26:50):
Absolutely. We’ve always said, uh, internally our internal moniker, uh, is that speaking is our paid prospecting.
MM (27:00):
Absolutely. Couldn’t have said it better.
AJV (27:02):
Um, it’s always been our paid prospecting. There’s very few times and the in life where you have a captive audience trapped in a room forced to listen to you for an hour. So it’s like you better over deliver. And when you do, there’s a lot of benefit that can come from it. Right.
MM (27:19):
Absolutely.
AJV (27:20):
Um, so I wanna talk, so I wanna talk a little bit about what you actually talk about just because I think this is really timely for where we are in just American work culture. Um, because you talk about leadership and culture and, you know, organizational performance. And we can, I can use all these other fancy words, but like, ultimately it’s like, I would love to hear some of the conversations that you’re having with leaders, entrepreneurs, organizations, whoever it may be around how to lead right now, or how to create culture in a virtual working environment, which a lot of companies still haven’t really figured out, or just, how do you like get optimal performance out of a whole team, not just an individual, so you can take any one of those topics and go, I like that one. Uh, but I would love for you just to speak some wisdom into, you know, what you talk about for your profession, what you love talking about. Like, give us, give us some insight what’s going on out there. Why is everything crazy?
MM (28:22):
Absolutely. You know, I think one of the things for me that I, I really talk lot about now is, is humanizing leadership. And, and what I mean by that is you would be very, very surprised and shocked if you just went, walked into an organization, let’s say you’re walking into an 18,000 person organization. And you interviewed all of the direct reports for, let’s say maybe 17 leaders on the executive team. And if you sat down with those direct reports and asked them, how many times a week, a week or month are you getting one on one frequent check-ins about not only your performance, but also how you’re feeling and development opportunities to advance your career and frequent check-ins about how you’re feeling in your wellbeing. Nine times out of 10, those direct reports are gonna relay back to you that they’re either not happening at all, or they’re happening very rarely, maybe twice a year.
MM (29:14):
So for me, it’s all about humanizing leadership. I think a lot of times our first assumption is to, I need to inspire with vision. I need to lay out this strategy. We need to focus on execution and all that stuff is very much needed. I mean, there, there’s no under minimizing that, but I think the first part is, I mean, you have to humanize leadership, you have to lead with empathy. You have to be vulnerable about what people are experiencing and going through in their personal life, as well as the professional life. And I think the more you can, you can bring that humanity in, into your one-on-one interactions with your direct reports and really, really prioritize it. Uh, even before you do your strategy or go to market route. I mean, to me, that is when you really, really start to create transformational performance, uh, in a team environment.
MM (30:01):
Uh, one of the other things I talk about as it relates to culture specifically, because that type of leadership does benefit culture. Uh, but, but really one of the big things that I do in my work is lead cultural transformation. So an organization let’s say is they went through a merger five years ago and this merger has caused some cultural friction. So they’ll bring me in to kind of not only revamp and enhance their current organizational culture, but also completely define and remodel a new culture and how that ties to the performance of what that organization does. And, and one of the very first things we do is we define their culture. And what I mean by that is, again, if you ask the employees of an organization, what is your culture here? Nine times outta 10, you’re gonna get someone to rattle off the core values.
MM (30:49):
You’re gonna say, Hey, are on the website, our mission statement set that that’s not culture, right? That that’s maybe a fabric and part of culture, but culture is really behavior at scale. It’s what everybody in their organization does when the CEO is not there it’s behavior at scale. It’s how we behave, what we believe and the experience that’s created both internally and externally. So for me, it’s, it’s really helping that organization define their culture. You know, what industry are, are they in? What is their uniqueness? Who do they serve? And, and really, what do we want our organization to consist of? Like, what do we want the core of our DNA to be all about? Because once you define that culture, then you can worry and work on the behaviors, connecting the values to behaviors, right? Because having a core value is just one piece of the puzzle.
MM (31:39):
That value has to be a daily behavior that has lived across the organization. So, so really for me, those are the two of the big things that I, I talk about AJ. Uh, and then the other would be just on the job transformation. And what I mean by that is there’s so many books and articles written about leadership, let’s say, but when you look under the hood of an organization, particularly larger organizations, you’re gonna find that all of their leadership development training, everything that they do, as it relates to enhancing the performance of their managers and leaders is not related to on the job performance. Mm-hmm,
AJV (32:38):
My gosh. I could go on so many tangents right now. Um, I’m gonna try to like brain myself in, cuz I, I could really go on a very long tangent, so, okay. I had three ahas, like three, like little epiphanies as you were talking. Um, and one of the things that I think is really important for anyone who’s listening in, to me, it doesn’t matter if you’re the CEO of a fortune 500 company or you’re a small business owner with five employees, or you’re a solo entrepreneur. Like there are elements of this that pertains to you, no matter what, or if you’re an employee stayat home mom or anything, it’s like, we all lead something. We just don’t treat it that way. But there’s something that you said about this on the job training and performance that I’ve noticed this trend in, uh, just haphazardly over the last 10 years is, you know, I left corporate consulting four years ago or it left me, I don’t know. Um, but separated from that four years ago and we started brain builders group. And one of the things that I had realized, and I’m just curious how much of this that you see is that it’s being outsourced to virtual learning and video trainings and tutorials and this whole concept of the metaverse and VR and all this stuff that removes every piece of a human element and pretty much every piece of on the job training from it.
MM (34:04):
Right. So
AJV (34:06):
I would love to hear your take on that.
MM (34:08):
You know, you’re, you’re absolutely right. And I think that the organizations that rely solely on outsourcing it are the ones that, you know, either will be distinct in 10, 20 years, or they’re gonna go through massive restructuring or their performance is gonna negatively be impacted dramatically in the market, uh, compared to the organizations that they do, classroom learning, they utilize zoom, they do, you know, AI, they, they have all of that that is coupled with on the job performance. And, and I think that that is the big indicator of, of really impacting and transforming the actual business performance, because that’s what we’re all in business for. I mean, unless you’re running a nonprofit, you have to be profitable. You gotta grow that profit every single year. And quite frankly, if you’re a publicly traded company, you have to also have the right perception on wall street.
MM (34:59):
And, and I, the way to do that is you have to really impact on the job. It goes back to football. You know, you don’t train to be a better football team by just watching film. You have to go to practice every single day. You have to take what you learned in the game, you know, in the film room. And then you have to apply that on the practice field, you have coaches that tell you don’t step left here. You need to make this right adjustment and go this way. And, and the same applies to leadership, same applies to business and you are right. I think one of the big misconceptions the past, you know, I would say five, 10 years has been, you know, we can spend our time better elsewhere. And my, all of my job is spent with leaders and, and executives convincing them that no training on the job needs to be your number one priority.
AJV (35:47):
Yeah. I love that so much. And I just, I know that that’s been like a huge increase that we’ve doubled down on this year with our team. And one of the things that I had found is it’s like the more virtual you go, the more distracted you can become, because there’s just so many different things buying for your attention. And one of the things that we have done over the last six months is for our, you know, community director who trains, all of our strategists is we’ve stripped away every single task off of her plate, other than being with our team. Like, that’s your job. It’s like, if it’s not that it needs to go. It’s like, you know, what we used to say is like, whether you spend time with paper or you spend time with people and your job is to spend time with people and this.
MM (36:31):
Yeah. But you guys did a very key thing there. And I love, I love that. I love that so much. AJ is you said, you know, we, we took all the things off of her plate. You know, she had to focus on that one priority and that’s, that’s the number one thing that most organizations do, uh, that, that really inhibits their performance and really declines the, you know, the growth that they’re looking for, because they’ll tell their managers and their leaders that we want you to be in the market, coaching your people more, but we’re just gonna continually dump all of these priorities and all these things on your lap and say, they have to be done by next month.
AJV (37:03):
MM (37:08):
Was us. It’s a lot. It’s it’s everybody. But you also learned from that and, and course corrected, which I think is very, very important.
AJV (37:15):
Yeah. Well, you know, to, I think, uh, the lessons in life, it was the hard way
AJV (38:12):
And he was talking about, you know, Kobe’s, uh, work ethic and discipline. And although Kobe was clearly very naturally talented, he just outworked everyone else with his workout routines. And he would start, he would do three workouts a day when others were doing one or two and he would go in at 4:00 AM. And as he was leaving, you know, the other teammates were coming in at 6:00 AM and he was already done with his first workout. And it was just that discipline of repetition creates excellence. Um, but it’s that consistency part. And it, and to me, that is just no matter what. And it’s like, you are a fairly new parent
MM (38:54):
Noah, fairly new and married. I was no, not, not, not yet.
AJV (38:59):
Okay.
MM (39:57):
Right. You know, I, I couldn’t agree more with you. I think that it goes back to the, kind of the, the old adage of, you know, everyone wants to achieve the dream without doing the work. And I think that at the, you know, for me, like every single year from my, my friend mutual friend that we have John Gordon, uh, you know, he wrote the book, the one, you know, one word and, and this year, my one word is process. And I think at the end of the day, I, I think one of the things that I’ve been so benefited by being an athlete for most of my life is, you know, going to the practice, just doing the daily work, going through the grind and, and understanding that it’s not even about the wins and losses. It’s about every day showing up and improving at your craft, whatever it is, you do getting a little bit better for that particular day.
MM (40:40):
And there’s two types of people. The, those that will think that that is cliche and yeah, you know, there’s, there’s a way around it. There’s a way around it. While the others, as you mentioned, Kobe Bryant, they’re doing the work and every single day, it’s about the process. It’s not even about wins or losses or increase in profit. That’s a goal. And that’s something we want to do. But at the end of the day, it’s all reverse engineering that to the present moment. And how can we maximize the process, the journey, which quite frankly, at the end of our lives is really what’s gonna matter most.
AJV (41:12):
Yeah. I love that. And I just think that’s so universal and you just really can’t hear that message enough. It may be said a million times. And for most of us humans, we need to hear it a million times more. You just can’t hear it enough. It’s like consistency matters doing the work matters, taking shortcuts do not help you in the long run. They really suck. Um, okay. So I’m watching the clock. I’ve got two more quick things for you. And I love this conversation so much, um, culture, you said it’s like culture is just behavior at scale. And I think that’s so good. And that’s so fascinating. And so, um, two things on this. So one for anyone who’s listening without doing like a formal assessment or, you know, hiring someone like yourself, it’s like, are there any quick tips that you could give to somebody that could just take a look around? And I’m gonna say the culture of your company, the culture of your household, but it’s like, how can you see, how can you recognize the culture that is all around you that often has been created accidentally or UN unintentionally. So how do you observe culture in the way that you described it as behavior at scale?
MM (42:27):
You know, that, that’s a very interesting question. And I think culture in and of itself is very fascinating. And I think one of the reasons why is because, you know, culture, you, you can’t see it, but you can certainly feel it when you walk into an organization.
MM (43:24):
And then it’s also putting a behavior next to that value. That’s what a lot of organizations don’t do the very first piece to actually building a great culture and identifying, are you living up to this? Well, you can’t just have the, the word trust on your website or say that trust is the core tentative of who you are and what you do. There has to be an actual daily behavior next to that. What does trust look like in your organization or your company? What does it look like? Like very simply clarify that make a concise statement, a daily behavior that is actionable, that is related to that value. And every single month, simply it could be done survey based. It could be done, uh, an accountability, which I use scorecards where a lot of the organizations I work with the senior level executives, there’s a scorecard that’s distributed to their direct reports on asking them, is this value, is this behavior currently being lived on a monthly basis?
MM (44:20):
And then we get those results back. And it’s very fun from there because there’s some leaders that don’t like, what, what we received back from the direct reports. But I think one of the things that you can do regardless of where you are, is, are, is that being lived mm. Is that being lived and it could be even be your personal life. You know, if you have a, a value or you have a core characteristic of, of who you make, what makes you, you is that constantly being cultivated and lived. And every Sunday evening, before you start a new work week, you know, is, is this being lived in everything that I do?
AJV (44:56):
Hmm. That’s so good. You know, I’m,
AJV (45:50):
Right. And it’s like, you can feel it. Like I was actually, um, we have this family Bible study that we’ve committed to this year. Um, and we meet every Sunday for four hours and it’s a family Bible study. Yeah. It’s a commitment. Um, but it’s awesome. And we’re reading through the Bible together. And one of the conversations that we had just two days ago is how there are parts of the country just talking about the United States that you can feel the culture, right. It’s like, they’re, you know, it’s like, you know, Southern California has a feel to it. Absolutely. New York has a feel to it. The south has a feel to it. Um, and it’s like, I liken company culture to personal reputation. It’s like, how do people feel in your presence versus how do you want them to feel in your presence?
MM (46:43):
Absolutely. And another thing I think, as relates to, you know, culture real quick, AJ, cuz it also kind of revolves around personal reputation and, and also the work that you guys do at brand builders group is, uh, being very clear on expectations. I, I think from both a as an influencer author speaker perspective consultant, you know, stating the services and the value that you provide is very different than constantly going to your clients and your customers and your partners and asking, are you consistently, are, are these expectations being delivered? Mm-hmm
MM (47:35):
And I think on the reverse for leaders and managers, one of the, one of the most awesome exercises that I have them do, and this is, this is a complete game changer because in healthy cultures and very positive and thriving organizational cultures managers with their direct reports, there’s very clear expectations, but most organizations you walk into, even if an employee’s been on the job for 20 years, 20 years, I see it all the time. And you ask them, Hey, in your role, your particular role where you are right now, where you’ve been for the last eight years, can you tell me that top eight biggest priorities day to day mm-hmm
AJV (48:51):
That’s so good. Um, and I think if you’re not taking this as your own takeaway, you should take it. It’s like, you should do these own exercises for yourself if you’re listening. Right. And it’s like, I like literally have like a page to do items of like, you’re this little direct reports, right. I’m going, are we on the same page? Right. Because that starts to emanate in every single thing that you do within the company and then in your client relationships. Right. So, um, okay. I know we only have like three minutes. So before we wrap up, I just wanna make sure everyone, um, knows where to go if they wanna connect with you. And so if you wanna connect with Matt, the central place to connect with Matt Mayberry is to simply go to his website, which is Matt Mayberry, online.com. So Matt Mayberry, online.com. You can learn about consulting speaking. Um, he’s got an upcoming book. You definitely wanna learn about that. You can follow him on different, uh, social media platforms that Matt Mayberry online.com. So with the last couple of minutes, um, I just wanna do two quick things. Um, and then we’ll wrap this up. So one, give everyone just a 62nd preview of your second book that you’re finalizing the menu script on. So when’s it coming out? What’s it about?
MM (50:08):
Yeah. So it’ll be out February 1st, 2023. And it is called culture is the way how leaders at every level can build an organization for speed impact and excellence. I’m, I’m very excited for that book. Uh, it really dives into some huge misconceptions, a little, some of the stuff that we talked about here today, but it goes even a little bit deeper. Uh there’s case studies in that book of some of the clients that I partnered with over the years of, of taking them through actual real life, cultural transformations, the results, and also laying out a, a strategy and, and really framework that leaders and managers, regardless of your industry and your organization, how you can implement that into build a world class culture that truly as AJ talked about, feels amazing, which will help you attract top talent, but also drive significant results in the marketplace.
AJV (51:01):
Mm. I love it. So culture is the way, love that title. So coming out, um, to an online store near you,
MM (51:34):
My favorite sport is football.
AJV (51:36):
Okay. What’s your favorite team?
MM (51:37):
My favorite team is unfortunately the Chicago bears
AJV (51:42):
Fortunate or unfortunate depending on where you live.
MM (51:48):
Ooh, that’s a tough one. Uh, my favorite book, uh, I will have to go off of one that I just recently read, uh, that I really, really enjoyed becoming super natural by Joe Spencer.
AJV (52:00):
Oh, very good. Becoming supernatural. Okay. Love that. Um, then you put the arts. What do you mean by the arts
MM (52:07):
Just different, you know, I’m a very creative person, believe it or not, because most people don’t take former athletes. Uh, macho men is very creative, but for me, it’s just, I, I love paintings. I, I love going to art galleries. I love, uh, you know, everything about the creation process, uh, you know, going to watch comedians going to, uh, you know, just watch the mechanics of musicians for me. It’s just, I’m, I’m a huge fan of creative in the arts and, and really bringing all that creativity and innovation. And really, for me, it’s all about the energy into my own life.
AJV (52:41):
I love that. All right. Last one. I know that you’re relatively newly married in the last couple of years, so I’m gonna still say that you’re a newlywed, what’s one lesson that you have learned about yourself from being married.
MM (52:56):
She is always right.
AJV (53:24):
Ah, I love that, Matt. I love talking to you. I love learning from you. Thank you so much for being on the show and thank all of you guys for listening. Stay tuned. Uh, next time for another episode on the influential personal brand. We’ll see you later.
MM (53:40):
Thank you, AJ.
Ep 335: Reinventing Yourself for the Next Big Thing with Former NFL Player Clay Harbor | Recap Episode
AJV (00:02):
Hey everybody, this is AJ Vaden here, and welcome to my recap episode on my conversation with former, former NFL player Clay Harbor. I don’t know why that’s such a tongue twister for me, former NFL player, Clay Harbor. And this is a, I would say an inspirational, motivational episode, but also with some tactical details about how to launch and grow your personal brand if you are thinking about starting or growing your coaching, consulting, speaking business. Definitely worth a full listen. But here is my take on this episode and some of the big things that I walked away with from this and my, my view on this, and I think this is a, a really important conversation to have, is how is comparison holding you back? And on the interview, Clay talks a lot about showing up and the difference between 80%, a hundred percent, 0% and the importance of not just showing up but showing up consistently.
AJV (01:07):
And then it got me thinking about my own life and lives of people I know and how much that comparison is the reason that we don’t show up. And most often the reason that we don’t show up consistently. And so here’s my question for you today, if you’re listening to this video, is what are you comparing yourself to or who are you comparing yourself to that you need to let go? And I don’t care who you are, what you do, there is something or someone that you compare yourself to that at some point in your life will make you feel not good enough, not worthy enough, not smart enough, not successful enough not doing enough, not helping enough, not making enough whatever it is, fill in the blank, not enough. And that’s what comparison does. Comparison makes you feel not enough.
AJV (02:08):
And that’s the problem with comparison is so often as individuals specifically individuals who are trying to do something bigger than what we’re currently doing is we get stopped by looking around and comparing our step one to someone else, their step 1000. And we just don’t know what their step is. And I just, I know when we started Brand Builders Group just four and a half years ago, it was really easy to go, Oh my gosh, here we are starting a personal brand strategy firm. And our personal brands had recently been scratched and completely, we were completely starting over. So neither my husband, Roy Va in our eye had any social media followers. We, we had lost our podcast. We hadn’t even started a new one. We hadn’t even created a website for Brand Builders Group when we started.
AJV (03:06):
And there was a lot of opportunity for us to go, We can’t do this because of this, this, this, and this. Like, what are people gonna think if we’re a personal brand strategy firm and we don’t even have a podcast launch, we have no social media followers, we don’t even have a website for goodness sake. What will people think? And I know that in many times in our life and in my life specifically, that would’ve stopped me. It would’ve held me back and said, Well, here’s one excuse of why I’m not ready. And here’s another excuse of why I don’t have time and here’s another excuse of how I can’t afford it. And here’s another excuse of, well, what are people gonna think? I could go on and on and on. The point is, is they all had to do with comparison. Cuz the truth is we did launch Brain Builders group with no website and with no social media followings and with their podcast. And we were just fine. We were just fine. And that had a lot to do with doing it in spite of what we thought other people would think. It was doing it in spite of,
AJV (04:51):
Sorry, you’re gonna have to cut this part together where we fell downstairs. He’s okay. But we had to do this in spite of what we thought other people were gonna think. Because here’s the truth, we could have launched with all of those things and people were still gonna have opinions, good or bad. So we could launch without all of those things. And people were still gonna have thoughts, good or bad. So why not just do it? Cuz the truth is comparison most often just hurts us. There’s always gonna, people who love you and love what you do, gonna and love what you do. There’s always gonna be people who don’t love you and who don’t love what you do. That cannot be what holds you back because that only hurts you, comparison hurts you. It’s an internal thing that we suffer with and we’re the only ones who actually have negative effects from how we compare ourselves to.
AJV (05:43):
And it, it’s really easy in a world today to get caught up with, well what does this person have and what do they look like and what are they wearing and what are they doing? And how many followers do they have? And what, how many likes do they have? And how many downloads and how much do they make? And sometimes we just need to stop looking around and put on some blinders and go. Everybody is on their own path. Everyone is on their own journey. And truly as an outsider looking in, we get a very surface level perspective of what every single person is going through. Cuz at the end of the day, we all know that every single person on planet Earth has a struggle. They have problems, they have issues. They have their own insecurities. They suffer with their own level of comparison.
AJV (06:27):
And we don’t get that picture. We don’t get to see all of the struggles and the hurdles and the obstacles that happened you know, years before or days before. We don’t get to see the behind the scenes that would eliminate the level of comparison and the significance that that has in our own decision making. And so if we stop looking around and we just put our heads down and and focus on what are we called to do and what do I feel like my mission is? And you know, for me it’s like, what is the calling that God has on my life and how can I serve people? And I think that’s the biggest thing is like when we’re focused on showing up for other people, comparison starts to go away. When comparison creeps in is when I’m worried about me, myself, and I, but when I’m worried about who I’m serving and I’m worried about my clients and I’m worried about my family and I’m worried about my friends and I’m worried about causes that I believe in when I’m worried about the people that I know are suffering, it’s like my comparison goes away cuz it’s not about me.
AJV (07:26):
It’s not supposed to be about us. And when you focus on serving and you actually focus on like, I think I could help somebody I I know I could help somebody. And even if it’s one person, it’s like, focus on that person. And those feelings of comparison start to go away. And it doesn’t really matter if you have a nice website or hundreds of thousands of followers or a bestselling book or you know, a notable podcast. And those don’t get me wrong, those things are great and I think you help a lot of people and you get more reach. So don’t get me wrong here, but when you focus on the one, when you focus on serving who’s right in front of you, the neighbor next door the kid down the street, your colleague, your coworker, that client who really needs you, comparison just diminishes.
AJV (08:12):
It just starts to go away. But you gotta show up. And you gotta do it consistently because comparison will creep back in the moment that you stop focusing on the people around you, the people that you were called to serve. And so I do encourage you to go listen to this whole podcast cuz it is about showing up and doing it consistently and not making it about you. And I think that’s where we get to shine the most is when it’s not about us. When it’s about the audience and the people that we can help and that we can serve. And the benefit for us, in addition to doing good works is that feeling of comparison goes away. And what it’s filled with is satisfaction of knowing. It’s like I have purpose. I can do things for people who need help. And it gives you a newfound level of purpose and passion and mission that maybe didn’t exist the minute before you did it. So focus on serving, it, eliminates comparison. Show up, do it consistently and go check out this whole podcast. I’ll check you, I’ll check you next time on the Influential Personal Brand. See you later.
Ep 334: Reinventing Yourself for the Next Big Thing with Former NFL Player Clay Harbor
RV (00:07):
Hey brand builder, Rory Vaden here. Thank you so much for taking the time to check out this interview as always, it’s our honor to provide it to you for free and wanted to let you know there’s no big sales pitch or anything coming at the end. However, if you are someone who is looking to build and monetize your personal brand, we would love to talk to you and get to know you a little bit and hear about some of your dreams and visions and share with you a little bit about what we’re up to to see if we might be a fit. So if you’re interested in a free strategy call with someone from our team, we would love to hear from you. You can do that at brand builders, group.com/pod call brand builders, group.com/pod call. We hope to talk to you soon.
AJV (00:53):
Hey everybody. And welcome to another episode on the influential personal brand. This is AJ Vaden here. And I have a friend on the show today with me, clay Harbor. You guys are in for such a treat. I’m about to give you guys a my version of his bio, my version of what you should know about clay, but let me tell you first why you need to stick around for this episode. So if you have ever gone through some sort of what I’m gonna call a change in identity, right? You could call it an identity crisis. I don’t think that’s what clay went through, but it’s a change of identity, right? So this is the show for you to talk about how do you take, you know, a large portion of your life that was leading up to this moment, and then how do you take all of that transition?
AJV (01:42):
What you’re doing, reinvent yourself, reimagine who you are, and then kind of like re-engage back into the marketplace. That is what clay is doing. That’s what he’s been doing. That’s what so many of us do at some point in our lives, both personally and professionally. So if you have ever found yourself in a pivot point situation of like, this is what I was doing up to this point now, what am I gonna do moving forward? This is an episode that you wanna stick around to also, I would say, if you wanna know how to grow maximum exposure and your online platform, by doing unique things that are out of the ordinary, this is also a show that you wanna stick around and stay tuned for. Cuz we’re gonna talk a little bit about that as well. So now let me introduce you to my friend, clay Harbor.
AJV (02:32):
Here’s some things that I think are fascinating, that you would wanna know is one at clay as a nine year NFL veteran, like nine years is a long time in NFL and my opinion but you were also a college hall of Famer at Missouri state, right? So pre pre NFL you are a nationally sought off speaker. You are a personal trainer, you’re a coach. You have so many cool things in your resume. But one of the things that I think is really fun and just unique are some of the things that you don’t have in your resume. Like I’m surprised that you don’t have in here that you also, you had a stint on the bachelorette like that’s how that did make it in here. I think that’s really interesting. I think also the things that are in here that really are so awesome about you is that you are so humble.
AJV (03:23):
Like you are so humble. You do not talk about all these amazing accomplishments. You do not talk about all these awards you’ve been featured in all major sports media. You’ve done brand deals for anything from bud light to American airlines. And those are not things that you ever talk about, right? Those are some of the things that people will hold at the pinnacle of their career and you don’t even mention them.
CH (04:12):
Wow. One introduction. I appreciate you having me, AJ. And you, I just appreciate the opportunity to talk to your audience here and, you know, have a conversation with you. And I appreciate everything that you and Rory do and have done to help me really figure out exactly what it is I want to do and to structure that. And I think that’s a good lead in to his conversation is, is, is structure because when people ask me, how do I go from, you know, playing in the NFL for being in college, you know, just working towards this goal my whole life and just identifying as NFL player. Okay, your career’s over. I have a couple injuries now, what, you know, for me it’s what do I wanna do now? And that’s a question that I had for a long time, and I didn’t really know exactly where I wanted to go and just figuring out old, old school way of writing down the things that you enjoy doing and going to brand builders.
CH (05:07):
And the first thing they have is go, what are you an expert in? What do you enjoy doing? You know, what do people come to you for? What kind of advice do people coming for, come to you for? And having all these questions really helped me to figure out where I wanted to go with my brand after the NFL. And for, for that, for me, it had a lot to do with, you know, habits and routines and, and, and things of that nature. So that was big for me. And that’s what I wanted to really chase.
AJV (05:34):
Mm. I love that. And that didn’t start in the NFL. Like that started way before the NFL for you. Like that’s how you got to the NFL. So one of the things that I would love for people to get to know about you is like, what do you think that it takes to create the extraordinary results that you’ve achieved in and outside of professional athletics, but, you know, super specifically like making it to the NFL is a really small amount of people, right? That’s, that’s extraordinary talent, but more importantly, it’s extraordinary discipline and habits that are gonna both serve anyone really well during their professional sports time, but then also way after. And so I, I think it would be really cool for you to tell people, like, how did you get to the NFL?
CH (06:23):
It’s funny that you you, you already brought it up in my opinion is is habits to me when I look back at everything I did and, and how I was able to succeed. Cause you go back to college. Obviously I have a natural ability. I start to realize in college early on, but it’s not much different than a lot of the other guys I’ve seen. And people have asked me this, you know, there’s a lot of guys out there that can run and jump and play football. What made you go from the same level that these guys for you to keep improving and to keep moving and improving, to, to get to the point where you’re in this smaller college, Missouri state university, haven’t had a draft pick in 20 years from Missouri state university draft in 20 years before I got drafted there hadn’t been one draft pick and I got drafted in the fourth round, the Philadelphia Eagles.
CH (07:08):
And that itself was a huge accomplishment for everybody in the, in the area. Wow. How this guy from Missouri state do this? And I’ll tell you, AJ, it’s, you know, it’s, it’s simple but not easy. And that is you have to have habits. You have to have discipline and you have to have a routine for me. The thing that really kept me on track was having a knock out routine from the time I woke up to, I would look at my day and say, how can I fit in all these things I need to fit in? I gotta make sure that I’m eating healthy. I gotta make sure that I get this workout in. I gotta make sure I work on catching the football. I gotta make sure I work in on blocking and that can work in any sort of environment that you’re in and any job you’re in you, you improve, you get 1% better every day.
CH (07:53):
And then by the end of the year, you’re 37% better than you were at that the beginning of the year. So for me, it was getting 1% better every day, always changing my routine to be as effective as I could. And I just kept getting better as a freshman. I got better as a sophomore, better as a junior. And I got to this point where I was a really good football player in college. And then you get drafted and go to the NFL and you you’re back to the bottom of the total pole again.
CH (08:28):
And I do the same thing. I go through my routine and I fix it and I make it the best I can you go through these position battles, highly competitive environment, but you just gotta focus on yourself. That’s why I made sure to do. I focused on myself. I focused on my routine and I made sure I was disciplined. I wasn’t the most talented guy, but I was a guy that had put in the most time and could fit the most things in my day because I had that routine. And that’s how I improved and players that were better than me. That only lasted 2, 3, 4, 5 seasons. I was able to last night, I was able to take care of my body and, and be able to put myself in position to where I could take care of my family and, and things I’ve always wanted to do coming from an underprivileged background. It was always in the back of my mind to be able to take care of the people that were, you know, important to me. And that’s what I did. It was all about habits, routine and discipline.
AJV (09:18):
Wow. You know, you said something that really stuck out to me. I one, I love all of that and I think it’s so true. It’s like talent can only get you so far. Right? It’s like, you’re gonna have all the talent in the world, but if you’re not gonna apply that in a focus direction, it there’s a limit to that. Right. but you said something, you said, I focused on myself. So whether or not you meant this or not, this is what I heard. It’s like, yeah. I wasn’t comparing myself to other people. I was focused on what I was doing, not what other people were doing. So can you talk a little bit more about, you know, both in and out of football, like the power of just like, you know, putting blinders on, right. It’s like stay focused on keeping the main thing, the main thing, and that is not what everyone else is doing. It’s what you’re doing.
CH (10:01):
Absolutely. The most important person you can compete against is yourself. You’ll look on online. Or for me, I see some of these speakers, these guys, these athletes that I’ve had better careers in. And I see their, you know, they’re getting booked at maybe this gig, this gig. And I go, I have a better story. I’m a better speaker. You can’t focus on that. You gotta focus on yourself. How am I gonna improve myself every day? There’s the same thing in football. I look at these tight ends. These other tight ends, when I’m drafted, I say, I can do everything they can do. Why am I not getting this opportunity? Then I just focus on myself. And then that shows you put the time in and you keep working. You keep repeating things over and over again. You have a good habit. You have good routines, you have discipline.
CH (10:40):
That’s gonna show. If you keep showing up day in and day out, you start to stack these days. And that’s when you improve. You’re not gonna improve in football. You’re not gonna go from a rookie to a pro bowler. You know, it’s gonna take you a little bit of time. Maybe sometimes, you know, guys will get lucky with a big catch or a big play, or, you know, in the speaking world or the business world, you’ll come up with just one big idea, but that’s not common. You know, what’s common is you’re putting in the hard work day in and day out. You’re improving a little bit every day, a little bit every day. And then you look up six months later. Wow. I’ve I was back there, you know, six months you look back, I was a guy that was barely making the team.
CH (11:19):
Now I’m a starter. And that’s when you keep going and you keep going. And the next thing you know, like my, my college career, wasn’t playing at all as a freshman, barely got in the field, improve, improve. Wow, I’m on the field. Now, as later, later in my freshman year, I’m playing sophomore year. Next thing you know, I’m an all American. And I look back at, at everything that I did to get here. And that was just a day in and day out. It didn’t happen in one day mm-hmm
CH (11:59):
You gotta consistently show up just like my time as a fitness coach, you know, I’m a certified personal trainer. I’m a certified as strength conditioning coach. You are not gonna see results in a week. When you keep showing up. My mom has lost 50 pounds in the last three months. Wow. Cause I finally got her on a routine in a program. She walks a mile every single day. I explained to her, your diet, your walking, your activity level, everything comes together. Now. She feels so much better. She’s able to walk and play with the grandkids. She’s able to travel with me when I go see my brother and all these things. But she, she took a day, a day, a day, a day. It’s you’re not gonna wake up and it’s not gonna happen. That’s why I try to explain to people is it’s the day to day, every day routine,
AJV (12:40):
You know, it’s the exact same thing with building a personal brand establishing yourself in the marketplace, building a business. It’s like, none of this happens overnight or in a, a week or a month or in a year for most cases. This is, you know, it’s what they say. It’s like anything worth doing takes time. Yeah. Right. It takes time. And it’s that discipline and consistency of showing up that I think that’s huge. You gotta show up,
CH (13:03):
Showing up is the number one thing. You go back to me and my fir my personal fitness brand. And when I’m, when I’m doing that, here’s what I tell people. If you, if you can only go to the weight room for an hour, go for that hour. It’s like in, in school, if somebody fails or somebody’s not getting the grades they want, it’s because of the missed assignments. If you get a 0% and then you get a hundred percent, you’re still only at 50%. Okay? So now you go back and you get a 60%. That’s not good. I mean, you still might be failing that day or, you know, you’re barely passing, but that 60%, and then you come back and you have a really good day. You get that a hundred percent. Now you’re an 80, you know, you go from a 50 to an 80 just by getting, just by showing up in the weight room.
CH (13:42):
When you miss the days, when you have the days where you don’t do it, where you’re not focused, you’re not gonna do any work. Those are the days that sets you back. If you can just sit down and do some work, you keep moving forward. Cuz every day improves. You improves you when you stay still and don’t do anything. That’s when you go back down and when you, when you start to, you know, you start to fail and whatever your business is, whatever your enterprise is, it’s your health, your fitness. If it’s your speaking business, you gotta keep moving forward. And you don’t miss days. That’s if you just show up every day, the discipline have that routine, you show up. That’s when you start to see the improvements,
AJV (14:16):
Oh man, we get in this podcast right now. That is so good. That is so much truth because it, it is like, it’s like you can apply that to your finances, your health, your marriage, your relationships your, your platform. It’s like, you know, I think about, as you were talking, we have a, a good friend of ours who is recently named one of like the sales influencers of the year on LinkedIn and oh wow. It was a really simple formula. He posted a content video on sales every single week for about 18 months.
CH (14:49):
Yeah,
AJV (14:50):
It was. I mean his content, clearly it got better. His skills get better, but it wasn’t like, it was that different. Yeah. It got better, but it wasn’t different. Yeah. It was consistency. He showed, showed up. He gave value and the more he did it, the better he got, but it was, he showed up and he goes, I’m committed every Wednesday. I’m gonna do this video. I’m gonna post it. If it helps one person it’s enough for me. Yeah. And then it was helping 10 and then a hundred and then a thousand and then a hundred thousand. Right. But it was consistency. I think the challenge is how many of us want it right now? Yeah. It’s instant gratification. We don’t wanna wait. We don’t wanna put in the work. It’s like, we want it now. And we want it. All of it right now.
CH (15:30):
Yeah. You got, you gotta be consistent. You wanna grow following on social media, your platform, it’s consistency. It’s consistently posting and doing things like that. What I always say is people is sometimes it’s better. I know some, the people tell me, well, I don’t know when the right time to do it is when should I start? And I always tell ’em this. I go a great plan. A good plan today is better than a great plan tomorrow. Mm-Hmm
AJV (16:00):
Yeah.
CH (16:00):
You’re gonna, you’re gonna get some pretty good and you’re gonna keep getting better and that’s gonna exponentially improve you. If you’re trying to work on social media, you don’t know exactly. You don’t have the perfect aesthetic. Hey, start, start right now. Start posting. You’re gonna keep getting better and that’s gonna help you to improve in your business and your speaking business. You know, it’s, for me, it was like, I don’t know if I’m ready to do these, to do these events. Oh, Hey, I’m ready enough. And I’m going to learn and keep getting better. A good plan today is better than a great plan tomorrow. So you start doing it and then you see yourself improving, you see yourself feeling more comfortable, then you’re, then you’re ready to go. Everything’s firing. You can set up your routine, you know what to expect. And that’s another thing that gets you going, you gotta get started and you gotta stay consistent.
AJV (16:43):
Ah, so good. I love one of our good speaker friends. Eric Chester always tells us and reminds us, he says the difference between a good speech and a great speech is a thousand speeches. Yeah. That right. It’s doing it. Yeah. It’s just doing it right. It’s showing up. It’s being consistent. It’s putting in the work. So, okay. So I wanna talk about, I’m gonna change, you know, change chords just a little bit. And I wanna talk about kind of this, this pivot moment that you went through, not all that long ago when your NFL career ended and now you’ve got post NFL life of all right. Now, what am I gonna do? So can you take us back to that? And because I think a lot of people in our audience are struggling in one of those pivot moments of, you know, they’re in a full-time corporate job and they’re trying to pivot too.
AJV (17:34):
It’s like, I wanna go out and do my own thing or I wanna start my own business or maybe they have their own business and they’re looking at evolving it or selling it or starting something new, or maybe they’ve sold their business. And they’re like, you know, what does chapter two look like for me? And what do I want to be known for? And, and I can just personally say, like, I went through this in 2018 of when we had our separation from our former company. And yeah, I was known for 15 years. As a sales consultant, I was really good at it and was making a lot of money at it. Yeah. But I looked up one day and I was like, I don’t wanna be known for somebody who helps companies increase their top line and bottom line. Yeah. Like I don’t, I don’t wanna look 15 years from now and go, that was my legacy.
AJV (18:19):
That’s how people think of when they think of me as they think of me as a sales consultant, I don’t wanna be known for that. And so it was a, an intentional shaping of how do I, how do I even wanna be known in the marketplace? And it’s a, and I think anyone who’s going through a major transitionary time has gotta look themselves and I, and go what what’s next? And who am I? Right. Who am I? I’m not this. Who am I, so can you gotta walk us through, like, what was that journey like? And how did you kind of get to where you are today?
CH (18:49):
Yeah, no, that’s, that’s a very good question. And that’s, that’s something that I like helping people with. It’s a journey that was difficult. And for me, it’s a journey I’m still going through. I think every day, it’s, you know, it’s something that you, you, you gotta figure out for yourself is, you know, am I happy where I’m at and what I’m doing and, and is this the path that I wanna be on? And I, I’m happy that I’ve finally figured out exactly what I want to do. And I want to thank you, firstly, and Rory for helping me a lot with that with brand builders, but I’ll go back to 2018, you know, NFL, I think I’m still playing. It’s a little different for me because I wasn’t ready to get to end. I’ve played this long career and I wanna keep going. And I get injured during a workout, which I would’ve got signed with a, with a team, the Buffalo bills, I’m on the field.
CH (19:33):
I’m working out. If I’m healthy in shape, they’re gonna sign me. I’m running a route. I’ve ran a million times. I run the route I plant, I cut. I end up tearing my groin. So now that’s tough. I go to the doctor, I see ’em out for six, six months almost with this groin tear. And you know, I missed the whole season. And now it’s a question thing for me. Do I want to continue working to get back to the NFL or do I want to move on to something else? And for me, icontinue to try to try to go back to the NFL. I got some calls that didn’t really go for me. So then I try to figure out what I want to do next. And going through figuring that out. I’ve, I’ve went through the fitness stuff. I love fitness, but what I really decided is what do I, I want to help people and I can help people with their health and wellness.
CH (20:21):
And I still do that and I can help people with their story. And I think that I have a story that really could move people. And that’s what made me decide what I wanted to do for other people. It’s gotta be a passion when I’m on stage. And when I’m speaking, I’m speaking to kids, I spoke to a lot of football teams, obviously being in that, in that space and a lot of high schools, colleges, and just speaking to them and telling them how I did what I did, how I got from here to there. And then underprivileged kids coming from an underprivileged family to become, you know, what I’ve become. And my brother who didn’t play in the NFL and he was able to do the same thing and our parents never graduated high school. My brother’s got three master’s degree and he’s working on the doctorate.
CH (21:02):
You know, he was the assistant director of, of the assistant director of academics for university of Colorado for five years. And now he moved on to start his own high school as a principal. And he just passed his superintendent exam. Now he’s gonna be a superintendent of a big of a big high school. And our parents didn’t graduate. Didn’t graduate high school. So using those steps and me and him uses the same strategies I used. We work on a daily routine. We have positive habits, he’s got three kids, a wife, and he’s still studying to do his doctorate. And the guy works out six days a week. Where do you find the time he’s got a routine that helps him through that? But I think that’s number one thing is finding something you’re passionate about and, and using that field when you’re going through this transitional phase and really sitting down and it’s like, you learn in brand builders, write down what do people, what would people say you’re good at?
CH (21:52):
What do you enjoy doing? What are the, the main things that people come to you for advice? And when I started, started thinking about that, and I realized that is how I’ve become so successful. How did you do this? How did you shape your body in the certain ways of fitness professional? How did you, you know, make the NFL and gain all that weight? When you had to go from a wide receiver to a tight end, you had to be at a certain weight and I’ll tell ’em, it’s, it’s simple, but not easy. It’s a routine, it’s a discipline. And it’s, it’s, it’s that. And going through that transitional phase, those are the questions I ask myself. And that’s what really helped me to decide where I wanted to go. And obviously, natural, what are you good at naturally? What’s something you enjoy doing. That’s a big question, cuz you don’t wanna go through life. Even if it is very lucrative, you want to be good at what you’re doing and you wanna, for me, I wanted to make an impact in other people’s life. And those were the questions I asked myself and that’s why I went to the direction I did. Mm
AJV (22:49):
Man. That’s so good. It’s it always makes me think about like how long was I doing something that I didn’t love doing? Yeah. Just because I was making a lot of money. Yeah. and that was my truth. It’s like I was not happy doing what I was doing for a minute before. I actually wasn’t doing that anymore. And I, my story’s really similar to yours. It wasn’t planned or expected. It was really unexpected. But I needed it. I needed a, I needed like, you know what they say? It’s like they needed, I needed an abrupt change in my life for me to do a, a full evaluation. But I hadn’t asked myself, what do I love doing maybe ever.
CH (23:29):
Yeah.
AJV (23:29):
Until 2018, it’s like, I started doing something. Got really good at it. Just kept doing it. Yeah. But never in like 15 years that I stopped to say, what do I want to be doing? Yeah. What do I want to be known for? Yeah. and so I’m kind of curious, like for you today, like, do you have an idea of what you want to be known for in this next phase of life?
CH (23:52):
Yeah, absolutely. I want to be known for someone who’s a servant to others, someone that spends his time and energy to help people better themselves. And you gotta do that by first, you know, bettering yourself and then you help people find that path, that same path that you did to improve yourself. And if that’s for business, if that’s for health, that’s something that I’m really passionate about. And just going from where I grew up going from where I started from to where I finished and my story and my brother’s story and my family’s story and things like that. I wanna see those results for a lot of people, for more people that can get out of this perpetual your perpetually, like your poor or whatever. And I want you could, there’s ways that you can improve yourself and help your whole family’s future. And that’s what me and my brother really took tar.
CH (24:47):
We would talk as kids. I mean, these aren’t normal conversations kids have. I remember me and my brother sitting up and talking to each other, how we’re going to buy mom a house and we’re gonna help dad get a car and help our family and our grandmas. And we’re having these conversations. And you know, we put these strategies at the time. We didn’t know exactly what the strategies were, but that’s what we were using. We were using that routine. We were using habits and we’re being consistent and that’s what we did. And that’s what I really am passionate about doing, because I did it. Anybody can do it. Maybe you can’t be an NFL player and play nine years in the NFL, but you can be successful at what you want to be in, be at be if you use these strategies, if you use these habits, if you use a routine and you use discipline,
AJV (25:30):
Man, I, I love this so much. And it’s like, you and your brother you’ve changed your family tree. Yeah. It’s like, that’s, I mean, that’s gonna, that’s a legacy. That’s gonna go for generations.
CH (25:43):
Like that’s. And that’s what we’ve always talked about. Yeah. Is our family for so long, we’ve been underprivileged, you know, for so long, going back, both sides of our family nobody’s ever went to college, you know, and we both graduated college with good grades. And my brothers, obviously he had better. He was better at the school, the classroom stuff than I was, but it’s, it’s looking back and seeing what we were able to do just gave me so much confidence that I could really help anyone. If you use these strategies and you do these things to get to where we were in their specific career. Me and my brother have reached such a high level, just doing these simple strategies of having, just having a routine, getting up at the same time every morning, you know, making sure you get your workout and focusing on your health and wellness, just having these routines, having these habits, always having a book, we’re reading, always having a project.
CH (26:34):
We’re working on something to keep bettering ourself. My brother, if he, he always has this allotment of his schedule, he’s always learn working on some project, whether it’s a certification, whether it’s another degree, whether it’s something he’s always bettering himself. And that’s something I took. That’s why I became a certified personal trainer, a certified fitness coach, certified strength conditioning. I just applied to Kelly business school just to have that allotment of something to do to always better yourself, find your routine, find your schedule, keep it going, keep moving forward and keep showing up. And that’s when you look back and a year down the road, tears down, there you go. Wow. That’s where I was.
AJV (27:12):
Yeah. So why do you think it is that people can’t do that or don’t do that?
CH (27:18):
Well, it’s, it’s, it’s difficult. I always say it’s simple, but it’s not easy. And that’s a lot of things. Why can’t people stop eating junk food?
CH (27:58):
But the days that matter the most, the times that matter the most and your habits and your routine is when you don’t want to do something, you show up anyways, you don’t wanna go to the weight room. You end up getting yourself in there. You really wanna watch this and that. You don’t wanna open the book and do this project. You do it anyways. And there’s there’s habit stacking things you can use in certain things that me and my brother use when in college I used to, I used to be a video game guy. I wanted to play Xbox and I look back and go, what am I doing with this time? What, what am I getting out of this? I gotta stop playing, but you’d go home after practice. You’re tired instead of studying, instead of going to get a little extra workout and working on your craft.
CH (28:38):
So now what I would do is I’d unplug my Xbox. I’d put my controller up high somewhere that unplug my TV. So now when I do get home the next day, man, if I wanna do Xbox, guess what? I’m gonna have to go find my controller, plug in my TV, plug in my Xbox and sign in all over again. So now it’s like, I might as well just do this. And there’s little tricks that we’ve always helped each other do and use and that way. And there’s a lot of those, those things that we’ve done. And that’s what a lot of, lot of everything, the things I speak on is, is how those little tricks can help and, and, and just help you to improve and make you more consistent. But it’s just goes back to showing up every day.
AJV (29:19):
Yeah. That’s those are so many good little nuggets in there and you know, it’s a, it’s about removing the temptation, right? Yes.
CH (29:26):
Yes.
AJV (29:27):
You wanna lose weight? It’s like remove all the bad food from the house. Yes. Donate it. Give it away. Get it out of the house, right? It’s like unplug your TV, right? Yes. Turn your phone off after hours. All the hide, your remote, right? It’s like all those little things of like, you have to learn how to remove temptation, right? Absolutely. That’s temptation
CH (29:51):
Bundle something. One thing my brother does is something I’ve, I’ve always loved is he, he has a couple shows. He has to watch. Only time he can turn on Netflix is when he is on the Peloton or when he is riding a bike. So you don’t wanna work out. Okay. If I, if I work out, I can watch this 20 minute show this 30 minute show. So then he’ll go work out just so he can watch the show. You know, you bundle things that way and that’s an improvement. You know, maybe it’s a 1% improvement, but those 1% improvements add up and they keep you showing up and they keep you improving.
AJV (30:24):
Oh my gosh. There’s so much richness in that of, and that could be applied to whatever it is in life. Right? Yeah. It’s, I’m I’m reading a book right now called the ruthless elimination of hurry. And one of the statistics in this book I thought was fascinating and it said that the average American reads roughly 200 words a minute. Right. if that’s true, if that’s true and you were to read one hour every day for an entire year, you would actually be able to read almost 200 books in a year.
CH (31:00):
Wow. For one hour.
AJV (31:02):
Yeah. For one hour a day. Wow. at the average rate of reading. Yeah. Words a minute then. So think about that 200 books. Yeah. And like my goal this year was a book a month and I’m on track and I’m like, so proud of myself. Yeah. And then I read this and I’m like, oh man, I have a long way to go. They have a long way to go. And I’m a really fast reader. I bet my average reading speed is twice that. And I’m like, oh, what am I doing with my time then? And so it really forced this internal reflection of how am I choosing to spend my time? Because when I say I don’t have time, that’s not true. I’m giving my time to things unintentionally that are sucking up all my time instead of them on the things that I should. So I thought that was amazing. But then these were the other two statistics that I literally put the book down and was like, you have to come here this like what? And these statistics and these were from two and 19, 2019 statistics. And so they’re probably even far more greater right now. Yeah. and so here was the next one, the next one said the average American and the course of a year spends 700 hours on social media.
CH (32:16):
Wow. That’s
AJV (32:17):
Twice what it would be to read one hour a day. So if we don’t have time to better ourselves, look at what you’re doing instead. So it’s twice the amount of time. That’s two hours a day. Yeah. In and off of social media. And I literally put the book down and was like, no effing way. And so I pulled out my phone cause you know how your phone can track your social time. Tell me what its, and it was like this like aha moment of like every like five minutes here, five minutes here, five minutes here. It’s like,
CH (32:53):
It adds up.
AJV (32:54):
Then this was the one that I was like unbelievable. The average American each year watches TV for more than 2000 hours. That’s two and a half times the social media. Not in place of, in addition to,
CH (33:14):
Oh my gosh.
AJV (33:15):
So think about those things when it’s like, don’t have time to get healthy. Don’t have time to lose weight. Don’t have time to do this. Next thing. Don’t have time to read. It’s like I say these things, right. I have two young kids. I have a two year old and I just turned five year old running into business. I’m like, I don’t have time to go do that. I don’t have time. Like yes you do. Cuz my phone just said, so my phone said, yo girl, this is how much time you spent on social media last week. And then I was counting up like how many hours of Bridger Tim did I watch? You know? And it’s like all these things. And it’s like, yeah, yes you do. It’s like, but we’re not consciously aware of our time is going cuz we don’t have a schedule. We don’t have a routine. We’re reactive. We’re living this default life of just letting everything fill up our time because we don’t have a regimented schedule and routine that we’re proactively trying to get better. Yeah. love that so much. That’s so good. And it is simple that it’s so hard, right? It’s so difficult. It’s so hard.
CH (34:10):
There’s some crazy statistics like I next next speech I give I’m, I’m gonna put those in there and there’s, there’s a time and a place for social media connecting. But that amount of time you need to work that into your schedule and you know your routine say, Hey, after I finish a project, I will give myself five minutes or 10 minutes to figure out social media. And that’s how you bundle it. And you make yourself, you can make yourself be extra productive with it. If you give yourself an allotment at the end of a project, you have your to-do list. You go down and I’m a big guy of having a to-do list. I know some people say yes, some people say no. Some people say yes on goals. Some people say no on goals. I’m big goals. I’m big to-do lists. That’s what’s helped me throughout my life.
CH (34:52):
When I’ve been the most productive is goals. To-Do list. And you put, you put your list up. Okay. Here’s are the most important things I have today. Okay. After I finish this, I will give myself five minutes here on social media. I’ll give myself five minutes here and that’s the way it should be. And that’s something I’ve implemented. And I know I’m cuz I, you know, I make, I have a business, a social media business where I, I do influencing, I do brand partnerships. I do consulting with some of these companies. So sometimes I’ll convince myself that what I’m doing is necessary and I need to do this for work. And I find myself just scrolling. I go, okay, what am I doing there? And you’re convincing yourself that you really you’re benefiting from that, but you’re not, you’re not being productive. And when you put it in, you fit it in after the end of checking something off your list at the end, okay. I I’m gonna work on this for an hour then to give myself five minutes. Mm-Hmm
AJV (35:49):
Yeah. I mean I have found for me, it’s like I have to set a timer. It’s like, if this is a part of my business, which it is, it’s like, yeah, but this is what I’m gonna allot to it every day. Yeah. Set the timer. Cause otherwise that’s true. It’s like you just start scrolling and you’re like, oh wait, what was I doing? What was I supposed to be doing?
CH (36:05):
AJV (36:06):
Somehow I’ve ended up on the revolved shopping website and I’m like, that is not what I’m supposed to be doing right now. Focus back on track. I love that. That’s so good. That’s so wise. That’s so smart and it’s so applicable. No matter what your business is, it’s like, I think it’s a really great task for anyone who is listening to this show right now, just to take a quick inventory of what are you doing every day? Like do you actually have a schedule? Do you actually have a routine for your personal brand, for social media, for podcasting, for learning, for reading, for improving, for creating content, right? It’s like gotta have a schedule. Otherwise it’s like that just the, the at entirety of the urgent, right? There’s always gonna be something that’s urgent. That’s happening that fill, fills up this time that you’ve set aside unless you protect it.
AJV (36:51):
And I think that’s so applicable universally. It doesn’t matter what you’re doing as a parent, an entrepreneur and athlete doesn’t matter. Okay. All right. I’m gonna switch gears. I have two other quick things that I wanna talk about before our time runs up together. So one of the things that you did that I think is really fascinating that I did not know about you until well, well, after we were friends and chatting is you have this stint in the reality TV world. And you know, I was, and this was like, you know, six or seven months ago. And I was like, oh, I didn’t even know that about clay. And then I was like mine. And then one of our, my friends was like, do you not know how many like followers he has that are like just all these women that were like crazed for him.
AJV (37:35):
And I was like, I totally missed this part of Clay’s life. I don’t know how I miss this. So here’s what I wanna know. It’s like one, why did you decide to do it? Yeah. Right. How did that help you grow your platform, grow your audience. And then two, what are ways like I think what I think what would be most interesting is to this audience is why, like, why do you think people follow you? Right. Because I think a huge part of this is just exposure. Right? That’s putting stuff in front of a group of people that you’re like, no, I like him. Yeah. Like I wanna see like what he’s all about, but then how do you keep that going way after, you know, in this case a show ends. So walk us through that. Why’d you do it? How did it help your audience? And then how do you keep it going?
CH (38:15):
Absolutely. So I wish that I would’ve been a part of brand builders while a long time earlier than this, you know, it would’ve really helped me in my journey, but you know, I’m here now and it’s really been great. So after I, when I go on the batch ride, it’s my, I know my football career is winding down and I’m starting to look and see, okay, what is going on afterwards? And as far as the bachelorette, I get contacted by these people. They go through my agent and you’re like, Hey, he’s still on the football team. Like we, this is all in the off season, you know, we’re very, we’ll let you do what you need to do. We just want, really want you to come on this show. And so I’m thinking I’m like, should I really do this or not? And I’m like, maybe there’s, you know, some things can come from it.
CH (38:59):
And one of my passions was announcing announcing football and being a commentator. And I had known a few ex football players, Jesse Palmer, friend of mine. He went from being the bachelor to being on the ESPN and all these shows, Jordan Rogers, same thing, football players are being announcer. I’m like, Hmm, these guys have really used this platform to jump into their second career. Yeah. And that’s kind of what I was thinking. I go, I’m single, I’m unattached. I’m I’m not opposed to meeting someone and dating and getting married. I, I do want that. I want a wife. I want kids. I want all of that. So I would be open to that. But then also I think that this can be a way for me to move into a second career. I didn’t know much about social media back then. I had a private Instagram. I was on Twitter for a little bit.
CH (39:46):
And I had a Facebook page that I was connected to. My family didn’t even know people made money off of social media at that point back in 20 17, 20 18. So I go on the show and I actually end up getting hurt on the show. Not, not emotionally, physically
CH (40:32):
Yeah, great TV. So I ended up getting injured and whatever, and you know, I still go back to the NFL and that’s after that is when I tore my groin. It was kind of a, a spiral of things that happened. I ended up pull, tearing my groin in my workout. So after that, I’m still trying to figure out what I want to do. And then I go on the the spinoff show called bachelor in paradise for same kind of reasons. I’m open to, I’m open to a relationship hoping that happens. But I think it’s a way at that point, I start realizing this is a way that you can get exposure and build your brand. Maybe I could jump into announcing things like that. And it’s really puts you in front of a big audience, ABC prime time, eight o’clock it’s a great opportunity if you wanna build your brand for the cults kind of.
CH (41:14):
Yeah. So that’s, so that’s what I did. I didn’t leave there married or engaged, you know, sorry, mom. She always calls me. She wants grandkids, but I’m focused on so many things right now, mom. If you’re watching this it’ll happen soon. I promise
CH (41:57):
And I think you have to keep consistently working on it and it’s not something that’s gonna happen. Keep putting forth good content. And then you work with brands. I’d never worked with brands before. And then, then people like the content you’re putting out. They like how you brand yourself, what you stand for. And they keep working with you. I don’t have the most followers in Bachelor nation or anything like that. But I get a lot of deals with some reputable companies because of my brand health and wellness. You know, I I’m speaking on, on good things than just keeping your image and your brand is so important. These guys like, wait, I got better engagement. I got better, but you don’t have a brand. You don’t have something that you stand for. Yeah. So that’s a very important thing. When it comes to working with these companies and these people, when they want to hire you, it, it really comes back to your brand and brand building. Like I said, I wish I had went through some of these courses before I went on the show, but now I know more and more, you know what these companies are looking for, what these people wanna do when they’re hiring you, how do you sell yourself? That’s all things that I’ve learned from, from you and Rory and it’s, it’s been great. And I’m still learning.
AJV (43:02):
Yeah, I know. That’s so good. It’s you know, and a thing I love about this is a great reminder to anyone who’s like working to build their audience, build their platform. It’s like, you know, it’s like, you know, there’s, I know there’s so many things out there where you can like buy followers and you know, you can buy accounts now. And it’s like, why? Right. Yeah. What you really want is to be known for what you believe in, right. It’s to have a reputation that compliments all of your values and beliefs and, and I love what you said. It was like, really like this show was a way to get more exposure. Yeah. But you know, it’s like, but what they were getting exposed to is the real you, right? Yeah. It’s like, they’re coming, they’re saying I’m all about health, fitness, wellness, positivity, schedule, routines, mindset.
AJV (43:48):
And it’s like, although they met you here. Yeah. Right. They’re they’re following and staying with you because they align with you. They like you yeah. They’re, they’re getting value from you. They start to learn from you and trust you, which is why they stay. Yeah. Right. Absolutely. I mean, that’s not any different, like, you know, I follow Leo Messey and Christiana, Aldo, right? Yeah. World famous soccer players and Nashville just got our first soccer team. Right. We just, oh, nice stadium. And so I’m like really going all in on learning all things, soccer outside of my kids’ Peewee soccer. And so it be fascinating. Like, you know, Christiana Ronaldo has got the largest social media following in the world, in the world, almost 600 and 600 million followers across platforms. Yeah. Almost twice the size of the United States.
CH (44:41):
Oh,
AJV (44:42):
Wow. Enormous. Right. Wow. But here’s the thing it’s like, people first heard about him because of his amazing skills in his sport. Yeah. But once you go to his profile, he has hardcore health, wellness, fitness. Yeah. He a die hard health, nut nutrition. It’s about his family. I think they have five kids. It’s about a lot and commitment to his wife being a father. Yes. He talks about soccer and modeling and there’s lots of shirtless posts that doesn’t hurt him. I’m sure. Yeah. But it’s a lot about like what you put into your body exercising fitness routine schedule habits, right? It’s like people may have heard about him because of soccer. Right. People may heard, learned about you because of the bachelorette. If they were watching. Yeah. Know, people may have heard about me because of something, but if you can stay true to your brand, if you can stay true to the reputation that you’re building, and if you get clear on what you wanna be known for, then when people find you, it’s easy for them to go.
AJV (45:42):
Yes. I want more of that. Yes. I like this. Yes. I will follow this. Yes, absolutely. To engage with this. But if that’s not clear, then I don’t know what I’m coming for. Right. Yeah. It’s like, it’s the same. It’s like, if I would’ve come to your profile, you know, back in 2018, when you were on the bachelorette or whenever that was 17. Yeah. And you were just pictures of you and chicks all the time. I would’ve been like pass. Yeah. But if I would’ve come and it’s like, no, I’m looking for health, fitness, wellness, inspiration, motivation habits, routines. It wouldn’t have mattered where I learned about you from, because once I’m there, I’m like, that’s what I want more of.
CH (46:20):
Yeah.
AJV (46:21):
And that’s sounds for any of us. So it’s like the question is to everyone listening, it’s what are you doing to increase your exposure? Right. Absolutely. This was a great way of growing and building your platform. But it was in a way that was in line and true to who you were and what you had to be talking about already.
CH (46:40):
Absolutely. You gotta have that brand and that’s how you get, get an audience and keep an audience, a loyal audience. And, and even after, you know, the show, a lot of people, you know, a lot of the people that go on these shows are audience start to go down and dip and you’ll see people that don’t really have a brand, just keep posting themselves with, you know, friends or family and stuff. And you, you know, you gotta, you gotta give people a reason to follow you. And, and for me, it’s a lot to do with health and wellness. And now I’m really working on some cool things to do with the motivational space, the habits and routine coming out there. And I’m really excited to show people that side of me too. So it’s, it’s, you gotta give some reason, you know, what am I getting out of following this person of, of staying, you know, involved in what this person is doing. And if you give people something, you, you generally give them something that they, they can use, they will follow you. And, and that will, will help both of you.
AJV (47:33):
Yeah. You gotta give them some value, right? Like
CH (47:35):
Gotta give value. Absolutely.
AJV (47:37):
Like give value, build trust. Yes. Again, simple. Not easy. Yes. Alright. Last question, clay. And then I’m gonna let you go. What do you wish people knew about you that they don’t know right now?
CH (47:49):
That’s a good question, AJ. And you know, there’s, there’s quite a few things. I, I mean, I don’t wanna tell people that my, you know, my first love was, was trying to be a singer and I, my mom had to tell me, clay, you have a terrible voice and you’re never gonna do that. But that’s something funny, mom.
AJV (48:07):
Thanks.
CH (48:07):
But something that I, you know, I do we’ve talked about a little bit on the show is just where I’ve come from. I haven’t spoke out much about my, my history, my background, where I come from, you know, people see me and, you know, living a good life and taking trips and, you know, and living in a nice home or nice car, whatever. But I really want people to know that this is not something that I was given for me. It was all about discipline routine and hard work. And, you know, I was, I lived in a trailer with 12 people growing up. I didn’t have my own bed until I went to college, shared to bed with my mom and my brother. You know, this is where I came from. And this is what people can do. If you just have the habits that discipline routine you can grow and you can change your life. Even your family’s life, your, your family’s trajectory this way. Me and my brother, both it wasn’t just because I hit a home run and could play NFL football. You know, some people might say, oh, you got luck. You could play NFL football. Look at my brother. He didn’t play NFL football. And he’s doing the same thing
AJV (49:05):
He’s
CH (49:05):
Working. Yes. He, he’s working a great job. Him and his wife are, are doing very well financially. They have amazing kids. They keep bettering themselves. They keep this routine. They always have a project. It’s, it’s something that, that anybody can do. And that’s something I want people to know that I wasn’t given to me. I had to work for it. And that’s why I’m so passionate about getting my message out there,
AJV (49:28):
Man, clay, I hope this becomes a pivotal part of your story. I hope that one day for every kid, every young person, every adult who looks out there and says, woe is me. Yeah. Look at my situation. I can’t do anything about it. That would be able to then look at you and go, but yes you can. Yeah. But it’s hard work. It’s hard work. It’s discipline and it’s habits and it routine. It’s like, yeah. I love that you changed, you know, the trajectory of your family tree, you and your brother. It’s like, I would really love to meet your parents one day. Yeah. How proud of you guys, they must be. And man, I just, I love your story. I love your heart. I love what you doing. So honored to get, to know you and get to be a part of your story and your journey. Thank you so much for being on the show today. If people wanna follow you online, where should they go?
CH (50:19):
You can follow me on my Instagram clay HARs 82, or you could just message me on my website, clay Harbor, online.com. And if you want to just talk to me about possible speaking, gig consulting health and wellness training. My website, it’s all there. Clay Harbor, online.com. Social media, clay. Harbor’s 82 on Instagram. And yeah, I appreciate you having me on AJ. And I look forward to seeing you and Rory at, at the next brand builders event.
AJV (50:49):
Yes, likewise. And y’all, it’s like if you’re looking for a great podcast, host, go to clay Harbor online.com request him as a guest. If you’re looking for a speaker at your upcoming event, go to clay Harbor, online.com, check him out. You will not be disappointed. I promise I’ll put all these links in the show notes and we’ll catch you guys next time on the influential personal brand. See you later.
Ep 333: Build Your Brand by Building Your Audience with Amberly Lago | Recap Episode
RV (00:07):
Hey brand builder, Rory Vaden here. Thank you so much for taking the time to check out this interview as always, it’s our honor to provide it to you for free and wanted to let you know there’s no big sales pitch or anything coming at the end. However, if you are someone who is looking to build and monetize your personal brand, we would love to talk to you and get to know you a little bit and hear about some of your dreams and visions and share with you a little bit about what we’re up to to see if we might be a fit. So if you’re interested in a free strategy call with someone from our team, we would love to hear from you. You can do that at brand builders, group.com/pod call brand builders, group.com/pod call. We hope to talk to you soon.
AJV (00:54):
Hey, y’all a J Vaden here and welcome to the recap episode of my conversation with Amber Lee Wago. And I love her
AJV (01:52):
So, you know, I have a lot though. Okay. I don’t even know where to start cause they’re not three. And I know we usually say three, but I have more than three today. So here’s a couple of things that I think are really good. We talked a lot about a common theme in this interview with knowing who your audience is, right? So if you’re creating content and I would say content is not restricted to social media or blogs or podcasting we all create content. I literally was on a text thread with a girlfriend today. Who’s like, Hey, I, I’m making a really big change in my professional life. And it’s really hard for me to ask for help, but would you be open to dinner or coffee or drink? So I can just get some professional advice or just some input on this decision I’m making.
AJV (02:47):
And it’s like, to me, I’m already mentally preparing of like, how can I best serve my friend in this conversation? Right? It’s like, I know where she is. I don’t know what advice she needs, but I’m already going, like, what do I have that could be a benefit to her. That is content
AJV (03:48):
So again, to me, it doesn’t matter if you’re a salesperson, a mom, a friend, an entrepreneur, a CEO, and executive speaker, author podcaster, wrap it all up right into one it’s communication. And in order to be an effective communicator, you have to know your audience, right? That’s not new. That’s not like we haven’t heard that before to have effective conversations and to be involved in effective communication. We need to know where the other person stands. That is your audience. This is just to an audience of perhaps more than one, right? And so you’ve got to know your audience. So then the question is, how do you get to know your audience? And that’s a part of your job and curating, who do you want your audience to be? Because you actually do get to influence that. And a huge part of it is who is the audience already around you?
AJV (04:49):
And what do you have to share and give to those people? What is the audience that you already have online and offline, but just as much as who is the audience that you want to attract, that you want to curate, that needs to hear what you have to say. That can benefit from something that you have to say, because I just really come from a place of every single person listening to this and everyone not listening to this. You have something to share that can positively impact and benefit the life of someone around you, whether or not you believe that to be true or not. It is true. There is a story and experience. There is something that you have that will help someone else, but it will be more helpful when you know who that someone else is, because that will allow you to reach those people.
AJV (05:45):
And it will allow you to have a bigger impact because there’s a little bit more focus and intention. So again, in order to have effective communication, I E creating content, you have to know who your audience is. So you need to know things about them. You need to inquire, you need to ask them, you need to have a relationship with them, but you need to know who they are. So that ties into my second one, which I think this is really good. How do you curate this type of audience? This is so simple that it kind of blows my mind. It’s like one of those things where it’s like, it’s so simple and it’s so true, but yet we don’t do it. Or at least I don’t sometimes. So this was a great reminder to me, the way that you curate an audience is to share what, you know, that’s, it
AJV (06:59):
There’s in this phenomenon of this thing called the imposter syndrome. And for a long time, I was embarrassed to ask what is that exactly? Because everyone talks about it, but I was really unclear what it’s about to Google it when they like, what is imposter syndrome? And then it hit me. And I was like, what an odd phenomenon that people somehow don’t feel adequate enough to live up to the accolades that they’ve actually done. Why this is, it was, it was foreign to me at the time. And this is my reconciliation of that is that often now you don’t have to agree with this that’s okay. But this is mine often when we suffer from things like imposter syndrome, it’s because we found, we find ourselves in situations where we don’t get to speak what we know, and either we put ourselves there or we volunteer to get put somewhere, or we got hired to put somewhere, but we’re in a situation where we’re no longer speaking what we know.
AJV (08:09):
And we’re trying to seem more credible or we’re trying to share pieces of information that are academically correct, but they’re not personally in tune with us. And I believe that’s where a lot of imposter syndrome comes from. Because if you just share what you know, then that’s just who you are.
AJV (09:08):
Whether someone else agrees with it or not. That’s okay. But when you speak, when you share what you know through your lens, you naturally start to attract people and simultaneously repel people. The problem with that is the third thing we’re gonna talk about is we want to be liked by everyone and we’re gonna have to be okay with not being like every one. That’s hard. It’s hard for me too. It’s like, sometimes I get like hateful comments and I’m like, delete
AJV (10:17):
Not, that is not a life worth living. Well, there will be people who love you for just the way you are. Just like, there will be people who do not even like you for who you are welcome to life. That’s already happening all around us. It’s just amplified with the digital, the digital atmosphere that we live in. But the more authentic you become, the more polarizing you will also become. But that means that you are attracting the audience that needs you. And you are naturally repelling the audience who does not. And that’s actually a really great thing because you’re reaching the right people and the people who don’t can go find someone else. We have to be okay with that kinda like three high level things. But I also wanted to share some of these one liners, cause I thought they were really good that I just really love this.
AJV (11:15):
It’s treat your audience like family. And she goes, I have even a hard time saying audience. These are friends. These have become family, but treat your audience like family. Just really quick little things actually listen to your audience meaning actually pay attention to what they’re engaging on. And I love what she said. She goes, if you really wanna know what your audience needs and wants, ask them and pay attention to what they’re asking you for. Go back through your DMS or look at your emails, look at your text messages pay attention to what your family and your friends and the people around you and your everyday life pay attention to what they come to you for, what they ask you for. But listen to your audience, actually pay attention to what’s happening. That will give you the direction of everywhere.
AJV (12:03):
You need to go. Just listen. So good. Become known for one thing, right? You, we talk about this a lot at Ram builder, screw you break through Shehan wall by becoming known for one thing, but it’s the more you talk about one thing, the easier it is to become known for that thing. So focus, right? Put a little blinders on here. Don’t get distracted by all the shiny things, all the temptations focus. And you can do that when you know who your audience is, the focus I thought that was really great purpose instead of trying to find your purpose, try to serve other people and you will find purpose by doing that. So good. Y’all instead of me trying to just sit here and go, what is my purpose? Right? I’m like a journal about it. I could read about it, or I can go serve other people and find purpose in the process.
AJV (13:04):
So good. So, so good. And then last but not least everyone you need to serve is already all around you. He just have to see him. And I love this. If you didn’t listen to her story I will encourage you to go do so now because she has a really amazing story about being in a pretty tragic motorcycle accident, went through 34 surgeries and lost her very well known fitness business, but she’s built a whole new business by just showing up and being present for the people around her. And it started in a gym not online. It started in a gym by her showing up every single day. The same thing can happen for you. You do not have to have millions of followers to make millions of dollars and you do not have to make millions of dollars to make massive impact in this world. Y’all, it’s an killer episode, highly recommend it. So glad that you’re listening, I really encourage you to listen to this one. If you suffer from imposter syndrome, if you’re trying to find your way, this is an episode worth listening to, so come back, check us out again and we’ll see you next time on the influential personal brand.
Ep 332: Build Your Brand by Building Your Audience with Amberly Lago
RV (00:00:07):
Hey brand builder, Rory Vaden here. Thank you so much for taking the time to check out this interview as always, it’s our honor to provide it to you for free and wanted to let you know there’s no big sales pitch or anything coming at the end. However, if you are someone who is looking to build and monetize your personal brand, we would love to talk to you and get to know you a little bit and hear about some of your dreams and visions and share with you a little bit about what we’re up to to see if we might be a fit. So if you’re interested in a free strategy call with someone from our team, we would love to hear from you. You can do that at brand builders, group.com/pod call brand builders, group.com/pod call. We hope to talk to you soon.
AJV (00:00:53):
Hey everybody. And welcome to the influential personal brand. This is AJ Vaden. Here I am one of your co-hosts along with my partner in crime, Rory Vaden. And today I’m always excited because we have such awesome guests, but I’m, I’m especially excited for our guests today because Amber Lee Lago is one of those people that even though we’re on zoom and she and I have never actually got to meet in person, you can feel the joy that just emanates from her being. And it’s like to honestly like your whole aura, just like brightens the room. And even when you’re over zoom, it still does that. And I just, I love to get to spend time with you. I love to get to talk to you. And I’m so excited to introduce you to our audience, but for anyone’s listening, if you ever had a friend or if you’ve ever known anyone that just being around them makes you in a better mood.
AJV (00:01:49):
That’s what you’re gonna get from Amber Lee today. So wherever you are, here’s why you need to stick around. You’re going to leave the next 45 to 55 minutes in a better place than where you started that I can promise you I don’t know all the amazing things we’re gonna talk about right now. That’s the beauty of the conversations that I get to have with Amber Lee. But what I do know is that you’re gonna be in a better place than where you are right now. So you need to stick around, you need to pay attention get out of pen and paper, right? If you’re driving, don’t do that, but listen intently, right? But this is one of those conversations that you just never know what you’re gonna get. And I feel that way every single time that I talk to you and I’m so excited to introduce you to our audience.
AJV (00:02:33):
So let me give you a little bit of a formal introduction so that I don’t forget any of the awesomeness that makes up all things, Amber Lee. So a quick, quick recap for all of you listening. If you are new to Amber Lee Lago, she is a peak performance coach. She’s a TEDx speaker. She’s a podcaster. Her podcast is awesome. I love it. She is a leading expert in the field of resilience and transformation, and she’s got a hell of a real life story to back that up. She is the best selling author of true grit and grace. She’s the founder of the unstoppable life mastermind. And I just love that title so much. We’re gonna talk a lot about this mastermind is its launching right now. But I think more than anything, what I love so much about you is you, you have this passion about you and what you’re doing and you have a real life story that goes along with it. And I think there’s a lot of power in having, you know, academic credentials and I’m not downplaying those at all, but for me anyways, in my life journey, people like you who have these real life stories mean so much more. And that is why I’m so excited to introduce you to our audience. So thank you so much for being on the show today.
AL (00:03:51):
Oh my goodness. AJ, I just love you. Did you see me kind of grabbing my arms when you started talking? It’s because I had goosebumps because when you were talking, I was thinking the exact same thing about you that when I see you even through zoom, I’m like, oh my goodness, you radiate joy and light. And just so I’m so grateful to be here and connect with you again and with your audience. So thank you for that most amazing introduction.
AJV (00:04:22):
Well, it’s all true. And I’m honestly, I’m, I’m so excited to introduce you to our audience and for all of you who are listening, you know, that we bring on really special guests that kind of like pull back the veil and kind of give up behind the scenes, real life perspective of how do you build a personal brand? How do you become known for something? How do you tap into that thing that we call personal branding, which, you know, to us is synonymous with reputation, but, and how do you build an audience and how do you find an audience and how do you become known for something that you wanna be known for? And so Amber Lee, this is where I wanna start just in case anyone listening doesn’t really know you. I would love for you to just give people a chance to get to know a little bit of your backstory, a little of your background, and like ultimately today, right? You’ve got this bestselling book, you have this awesome mastermind you’re launching, you’re a TEDx speaker. You’re an amazing podcaster. You’re keynote speaking. You’re doing all these things that you didn’t always do. Those things. Mm-Hmm
AL (00:05:38):
That’s such a great question because I actually just had a conversation with someone who was interested in joining my mastermind yesterday. And she said, yeah, but Amberly, you have all these things because you know, you have this story that you can tell this story. And so, you know, basically it was easy for me to get to where I am. And I just wanna say like five years ago, I didn’t even own a laptop. So when you say you have a bestselling book, you’re a podcaster. I knew nothing about technology. And I remember that
AJV (00:06:15):
Is there. I wanna make sure people had actually heard that five years ago. Mm-Hmm
AL (00:06:22):
Didn’t own a laptop. I had a smartphone. Is that what they even call it now? Like I
AJV (00:06:29):
Many, how many people truly are listening today? Do you think that truly give themselves the excuse? I’m just too late to the game, right? Mm-Hmm
AL (00:06:53):
My story’s not enough my story. And I’m like, we all have a story, you know what I mean? It’s like, we all have something to share an experience to share that could be a roadmap for someone else. And when we get caught up in that comparison or we give ourself, we make start making excuses, you know, I was 37 when my book came out. Yeah. I’m like, no, no, no, wait 37 that’s later. No, I wish I was 37.
AL (00:07:49):
I actually did those things because it wasn’t that long ago that I didn’t even have social media. And it wasn’t until I wrote my book and I had, you know, I hand wrote about 90% of my book on these notepads. I have notepads all over my desk. I love notepads, but I didn’t own a laptop. And I didn’t have a lot of people that also believed in me. And they thought I was crazy for wanting to write a book. You know, I was in the fitness industry for 26 years and they were like, why don’t you just stick to that? You’re the fitness girl. And I’m like, but no, I wanna write this book. And so I hand wrote about 90% of it. And one day was very discouraged when I couldn’t figure out how to send a picture. Like, I didn’t even know.
AL (00:08:34):
My husband had a, like a, a PC, like a computer. I did not know how to work. And I was, I asked to speak at this event for Lona Jane, which I was really excited about. And still I was a little bit like, okay, a lot imposter syndrome. Like, why do they want me? And I had to send them a picture like of me. And I was trying to find a picture to send. And I asked my husband, well, can you, you know, teach, show me how to send this picture in an email. And he’s like, oh, what do you want now? And I was like, that’s it. I’m just gonna go buy my own computer. And I went to the Mac store and I bought myself a laptop. And then I went to type my whole book up. I got a publisher and I love that you talk so much about the marketing and branding and the personal brand, because I love learning from you.
AL (00:09:25):
And so that’s one of the reasons I think so many people love all that. You share, love your podcast so much because we learn so much from you. Okay. I knew nothing. And this publisher was like, we don’t do any marketing or branding for you. So if you wanna get your book out there, it’s up to you to do it. And so I was like, well, I don’t have a big budget. Like I have zero budget. So let me try this social media thing out. And I had like a couple of hundred followers on Instagram. I literally, that were like friends and family. I basically had that account. So I could stalk my oldest daughter. I didn’t even know how to post. And I was like, well, I’m just gonna start sharing. And I started sharing what I had gone through, how I had to completely reinvent myself.
AL (00:10:15):
How’d I had to learn how to love myself again. And I started to share like mostly, you know, from a scar and not an open wound. And you I’ll get to the question that you asked, sorry, for this long, I love this cancer, but you know, I had this incredible career and fitness and for 26 years, that’s what I did. And so I had, I was a trainer. I had trainers that worked for me. I taught a trainer certification preparation course. I was like in it, I was sponsored by Nike. I was doing infomercials. If you walked into like a Rite aid or something, you would see vitamin labels. And there would be me right on the vitamin label. And so I, I thought life is good. After a lot of grit to get to where I was, I was like, life is good.
AL (00:11:10):
And that all changed. When, you know, one day coming home from work, I got T-boned hit by an SUV, thrown 30 feet on, on my motorcycle and slid across the asphalt. And I remember looking down at my leg and my, one of my first thoughts, AJ was this can’t be good. I might have to train clients on crutches for a while. Like I was already thinking, how am I gonna keep training my clients? I had no idea just how much this was gonna change my life. Rushed to the hospital. And I was putting induced coma. And when I woke up from a coma is when I learned, I had a 1% chance of saving my leg. And to me, it was like my leg. That was my livelihood running was my drug of choice. I mean, that was what I did for happiness. A lot of people would like to, you know, get rid of anxiety by having a drink or something running is what I did.
AL (00:12:12):
That was my therapy. And I thought, what am I gonna do? And, and I thought, well, 1%, well then there’s still a chance mm-hmm
AL (00:13:22):
I thought this can’t have happened for nothing. Like there’s gotta be, you know, I want other people to know that they can hang on to hope that they can. All you need is just a glimmer of that hope to keep moving forward. Because I was in a place where I did not wanna live. I went from surviving this accident and 34 surgeries to really sinking down into despair and depression and went from being this fitness expert to all of a sudden, I was drinking every day to try to cope with the pain. And it was at that moment, there was a turning point where I thought there’s gotta be more to life than this and climbing my way back out of that and rebuilding myself in every way, spiritually, mentally, physically, financially. I mean, we had 2.9 million worth of medical expenses. And so for anybody listening, who is going through a struggle right now, whether it is financially or physically or emotionally, I think there’s been a lot going on in the world, or even you’re in a place in your life where, you know, you don’t, maybe you didn’t get hit by an SUV, but you got hit by something in these last couple of years, that there is a way that you can strategically take steps to rebuild and tap into your resilience, to get through those moments.
AL (00:14:52):
And let me tell you if I can do it and completely reinvent myself and learn to love myself, you know, go from being a fitness model to being scarred up from the hip down and doing that all in my late forties. And now I’m 50, then anything’s possible.
AJV (00:15:13):
I mean, there are so many different paths that I could take this conversation from just even this very shortened version of just a tiny part of your story. That, there’s one thing that really sticks out to me that I think applies to probably every single person listening, which is this devaluation of their own story. And like, even to hear you say, it’s like, man, I hear this. I’m a podcast from my speaker and it’s oh yeah. It’s like, I do those things, I think today and every day. Right. I think throughout, you know, I don’t think it’s, I don’t think it’s different today than it was 50 years ago, or it will be in 50 years from now. I, I think that in general, we downplay the significance of our own stories and we forget that we all have a story and that our stories are lives are there for a reason now, regardless of what, you know, anyone’s beliefs are, who’s listening.
AJV (00:16:18):
It’s like things happen for a reason. And a part of that reason I do believe is to help us share it’s to create that community. And so I would just love to hear from you of your take on, like, how did you find the significance of your story in such a way that you’re like, there’s a message in here and I feel so compelled to share it that I’m gonna hand write it, right. And I’m gonna figure this out at 45, 46, 47, because there is something in this that I have to get out in the world. And I think that’s a really important thing because we all have those things. And most of us just don’t find a way to share ’em and it doesn’t matter to me, like you don’t have to be an author or a speaker or a podcaster or anything to go. I have a story that has the ability to shape and even change someone else’s life. So I could share it to a friend, to an employee, to a stranger, to my barista at the coffee shop. But how, how do you find the significance of your story and believe that it has the power to actually make a difference. And so I’ll just start with, how did you do that?
AL (00:17:38):
Well, you know what, I think that sometimes you have people around you that help you do that because I did not see the significance in my story or myself. I mean, I, to be completely transparent, I hated myself. I, I really just was very unhappy and I didn’t feel like I was enough. I didn’t feel like I was a good enough mom anymore. I felt broken in every way. And it wasn’t until I think a couple of things happened. And I mean, first of all, I will say that, like you said, we all have a story. We all have things that we’re, we’re really good at. And I would really urge anyone listening today to really think about what is that thing that people tell you that you’re good at, or that people come to you. And they’re always asking you advice on this one thing or this one thing that you could just talk about all day and it lights you up.
AL (00:18:43):
It gives you goosebumps. You would talk about it, whether you were paid for it or not, you would fly across the country to talk about it. Like, what is that thing or things, and start writing those things down. But for me, I did not see like I said, I felt really broken and I remember, you know, I was so wanted to get back. I wanted to get back to training clients. And I remember thinking I needed my clients now more than they needed me because I needed a purpose. I needed a reason to, I wanted to get back to work. I wanted to do what I loved again. And so I remember thinking, well, who’s gonna wanna train with me. Like I’m broken, I’m on crutches to my surprise. My business boomed because people saw me going into the gym in my wheelchair and getting up outta my wheelchair to do tricep push downs, getting back in my wheelchair with my leg, all bandaged up.
AL (00:19:43):
They saw me coming in after a surgery and having like an I IV in a wire that was going in a cast on my leg. And I was on the row machine doing the row machine with one leg. They saw me on crutches. They saw me back in a wheelchair. They saw me limping. They saw me before I could get my leg all the way up around the bike in the day that I got it all the way up and I could do the bike, like a normal person. Well kind of it wasn’t very pretty, but kind of
AL (00:20:26):
And I thought, if Ambery can show up, I can get my button at spin class and I can do it too. And then I would have somebody come up to me and say, Hey, do you mind talking to my aunt? She’s having a real hard time getting off the couch. If you could just call her. And so I’d call her and I’d give her a pep. And so IPEC talk. And I was like going to one person at a time. And I found myself on the bicycle at the gym. And there was a girl riding the bicycle beside me. And she noticed like, all these people were just coming up to me nonstop, like the whole hour that I was there on the bike and they were, would come up and they would tell me their problems. And I would offer solutions or suggestions that had helped me.
AL (00:21:08):
And she goes, don’t you get tired of people coming up to you with all your, their problems? And I said, well, no, not if I can help ’em. I said, I, I, I, I like helping people. So there was my first clue that there was something there because, and then it was at the doctor’s office. So I’d had all these surgeries still, like I said, I wasn’t, I had looked down at my leg with kind of discussed, cuz it was all scarred up. And it was given me so much pain. I had tried all these different treatments, ketamine, infusions, spinal stimulator, spinal blocks, Eastern Western medicine. I mean, you name it. I had tried it. I was on 73 homeopathic pills at one time, a day and 11 prescription medications and nothing was helping with this complex regional pain syndrome. And I remember I had this solution. I was like, well, we’ll just amputate. And I went to the doctor who saved my leg and I said, Hey doc, I really appreciate you saving my leg and, and doing all these surgeries. But you know, it’s slowing me down. We just need to amputate it. I can’t live with this pain. And he did something that just changed it for me.
AL (00:22:32):
He put my leg in his, you know, usually they’ll put your leg on the table. And I thought, gosh, I can’t believe he’s putting my, my ugly leg on his clean white coat. And he looked at my leg like it was a masterpiece and just something shifted. And I thought, wow, if he can look at my leg like that, maybe I can learn to look at it like that too. And so every day I just started to love my leg for healing the way it did or, you know, enabling me to walk again, enabling me to train clients again. And so I think that sometimes when we have somebody believe in us or look at us differently and they see the significance in us, it allows us to start to look at the significance if we can’t see it yet. And so that’s why I think it’s really important.
AL (00:23:36):
You know, I’ve heard the same success leads clues. When I started getting asked more and more to share my story because it was genuinely helping people and inspiring them and giving them hope. I said, well, how can I make myself better? How can I learn more? And I just dove into, you know, getting better and every way, spiritually physically, I already worked really hard on physically trying to get better, but mentally, emotionally. And then I started getting to my surprise, getting asked to speak at like bigger events. And then then I thought, well, I think I wanna do this thing. I think I, you know, somebody said, you know, you should write a book. And I thought, well, maybe I could make a bigger impact. If I wrote a book, it wouldn’t be one person at a time. Maybe just, maybe somebody would read this and I could share how I got through all of the struggles and it would help them get through some adversity they might be going through too.
AL (00:24:41):
And so that’s what made me decide to write a book. But I think that, you know, if we think about some of the things that we love doing, what brings us joy, I love people being with people, brings me joy, being with people and seeing the transformation in them. Ooh, that’s my favorite thing. And so when we think about what brings us joy, what we’re really good at those questions that people ask us all the time and it doesn’t have to be even people in your real life. What are people on social media asking? Yeah. Like what are people asking you in DMS over and over for me? Because at the time I didn’t have social media, I just went on what people were asking me like in real life at the gym, you know, when I would walk down the street. And then as I got to be on social media, I started really paying attention even more to what people were asking and I’ll never forget AJ.
AL (00:25:38):
I had this. So I was doing this big event. Like I was speaking at this event and we all gave away, you know, a, a free gift. Well, I was like, well, I’ve got a gratitude journal. I’m giving away. Like I’m, I’m living large. I’m giving away a gratitude journal and it’s even downloadable
AL (00:26:48):
But but you know, it’s like, he’s like, well, that’s the beauty. You don’t really know what you’re doing. And I still don’t. I think we’re all, I I’m just still trying to figure it out. That’s why I listen to your podcast so I can learn that the latest, you know, tricks and tips, but I think it,
AJV (00:27:07):
You have it figured out it’s everyone else who doesn’t have it figured out. And I say that sincerely and we, you know, over the last six months our company brand builders group has been going through our own reinvention and we just launched what we call B BG 2.0, because we’ve really spent the better part of this year, 2022 of refocusing on who we wanna serve, who we are as a company. And honestly, what do we think that we’re the best in the world at and as a part of its startup. And when we’re all getting started, it’s just, we do whatever you have to do. And you know, many people just stay on that track. And I really felt through a course of a, a variety of different events this year, that we needed a reentering back on the heart of who we are back on our uniqueness, back on what makes us different back on what’s made us who we are.
AJV (00:28:03):
And you said something and that I just wanna touch on for a minute, because I think where you have it figured out that truly no one else does is you learned the power of your surroundings. And most of us don’t learn that you see that the challenge that I see with so many people today is what they’re looking for is an audience. And an audience is just another way of saying a collection of individuals. And what we really need to be saying is how do I reach an individual? And people wanna see numbers, not people. And you saw people and people saw you. And for anyone who wants to build their personal brand, you know, build their reputation, grow their business. They need to focus on the people that are already in front of them.
AL (00:28:58):
Mm-Hmm,
AJV (00:28:58):
AL (00:29:24):
Mm-Hmm
AJV (00:29:25):
And it’s really them
AL (00:29:31):
Well, you know, I was just at, I spoke at a friend’s mastermind. That was, it was beautiful. I don’t know if you’ve ever been to Sundance, but I had never been to Sundance. And it was in Sundance, Utah, AMA beautiful. And when I’m at, at events, I’m, I am there for the people like I am there the whole time. And when I’m speaking at any event, I don’t just go and speak on stage and leave. I am there to meet people because I love people. And I’m there to be all in. Like my schedule’s blocked out. I’m not taking a bunch of call. Like I am there. And even my family knows, like when I’m at an event, I’m there. And unless like, you know, I I’ll talk to him at night, but during the day I’m like, if it’s an emergency, call me twice, you know, otherwise. And so this last event, I was speaking on a panel and my phone rang twice and I answered it and my husband was like, see, I told you she would answer it if you
AJV (00:30:40):
A test drill. Yes,
AL (00:30:42):
That’s a
AJV (00:30:42):
Test.
AL (00:30:43):
But yeah, but I’m, I am there and for the people,
AJV (00:30:49):
But that quite honestly is what most people are missing today. I really do believe that it’s like, you know, we talk a lot about online marketing and social media and funnels and webinars at brand builders group. But to be really honest and transparent, where we shine is in the offline reputation, everything that we can attest to in our entire business and why brand builders group even exists has nothing to do with podcasting or email lists or social media or websites or design. It has to do with long standing offline relationships that we spent time and years, years nurturing and building and pouring into and giving to give, not to receive. And because of those relationships is how everything else came a lot. And it’s no different than what you’ve done. It’s like you became known in the gym and then they’re like, well, I need you to know other people. And then those people are like, and I need you to know other people. And it’s like the real magic isn’t that
AL (00:31:56):
It sure is. And I mean, AJ, that’s how we met. Yeah. I had like three people saying, oh, do you know AJ? You same got to meet AJ. You have, she’s amazing. You just have to meet her. So by the third person, I was like, who is this AJ? But the
AJV (00:32:13):
Same happened to me. It was like, like, it was like, it was like, just like the, world’s like, you know, colliding of all these different relationships. But I think that’s, that’s the beauty of what I love about this part of your story is it’s people got to know you and it’s through relationships and it’s, you know, it’s through all these things that it’s trust, right? It’s like, it’s like, I know that, you know, know, I love what you said. It’s like my goodness, if she can do it, I can do it. I think about, I have, I have a girlfriend who has quadruplets that are six months older than my oldest. And when she got pregnant with quadruplets, she had an 18 month old and every single day where I have a hard mom day, I’m like, I have two, she has five, I have two, she has five. And it’s like, she can do it. I can figure this out. I’ve only got two. And it doesn’t mean that it’s not hard, but it’s like, that’s what she is for me and motherhood of. But that would never happen if there wasn’t a relationship. Mm-Hmm
AL (00:33:31):
Oh, thank you. Can I just hang out with you all day?
AJV (00:33:35):
Please feel I like it though. But it’s like, I think that is really important. And then you, and I love what you said and it’s like, then I said, well, you know, if I write a book, I can reach more than just one person mm-hmm
AL (00:34:02):
I love this question.
AJV (00:34:05):
I have my own thoughts of love, hate relationship with the publishing world. But I would love to hear your take on like okay, for all of you out there, here’s what you need to know. If you wanna write a book and you actually want people to read it. So,
AL (00:34:22):
Okay. If you wanna write a book and you actually want people to read it, you actually have to start writing today. Like make a commitment that you’re gonna do it, decide, and then get out your notebook. Look, I didn’t even have a computer when I started and I would get discouraged along the way. And I would have that soundtrack going on in my head. Like who do you think you are? Like, who cares about what you have to say? Like you’re not smart enough. You don’t have a college degree. Like all the things I would tell myself, but then I would focus on this. Isn’t about me. This is about who I can serve. And maybe this is really going to help someone cuz I don’t ever want anybody be to be in that dark place that I was in, where I was thinking, you know, my kids could find another mom.
AL (00:35:15):
My husband could, you know, find another wife. I don’t want anybody to ever have to feel that way. But mostly I don’t want anybody to ever feel like they’re they’re alone. You know that they, you know, pain tends to isolate and isolation for me led to addiction. And so whatever I could do, that’s why I wrote my book like that. You can get through hard times, but I would say start writing there. There’s so many ways to do a book. You, whether it’s hybrid, whether it’s self, whether it’s traditional, you have to decide how fast do you want your book to get out there? So talking about, you know, people again, I got my publishing deal through people. I had a friend of mine that invited me to, you know, go to this conference that was all for authors and there was gonna be publishers there and literary agents.
AL (00:36:07):
And I’ll just make this a quick story. But this goes back to how you treat people. I thought, well, you know, it was, the ticket was only like I think 50 bucks to go. I’m like, how good can this conference be? Like, you know, but that’s what was my thought? How can it be that good? It’s only $50, you know? So we go, it’s in LA and we get there and I’m getting in the elevator and I see this guy running to the elevator. So I hold the door open for him and he’s in a suit and he’s kind of got a sweaty brow and he goes, oh, thank you so much. I’m running late. And I’m like, sure. And we start talking in the elevator. So I get up to the conference, he’s got a table, he’s a publisher. So I walk up and I’m like, oh, he goes, thanks for holding the door for me.
AL (00:36:57):
And I said, you’re welcome. I said, you’re a publisher. He said, are you an author? I said, well I have a manuscript. He goes, well, let me see what it is. So I got my foot in the door by holding the elevator door. I love that story so much. And you know, I, at the end of this conference, you know, if you’re, if you’re writing a book, you can either do a book proposal. You can have a literary agent, you can self-publish and you get your book out there a lot faster. But they had these booths set up and it was like speed dating for authors. And we would go sit in the booth and we would have like a minute to pitch our book. Well, I didn’t even have a title to my manuscript yet. I just, I had some stuff typed out that I had with me, no title.
AL (00:37:45):
So it was a long day, 12 hours in, I hadn’t had anything to eat and I’m going to try to pitch this. I’m like, I’m doing it, man. I’m get in front of every publisher. I’m get in front of these literary agents. I’m gonna pitch this thing. Even though I don’t have a title, I get to the very end. It’s that publisher. And I sit down in front of him and I just, I collapse and I’m I’m I got tears in my eyes and he, he said, well, did you bring me something I can read? And I said, no. He said, well, why not? And I said, well, I don’t have a title yet. I don’t feel like it’s good enough. Like I just opened up to him. He said, you know what? Here’s a book. How to write a proposal. He gave me a book on how to write a proposal.
AL (00:38:27):
He sent me on his way with his business card. So I had his number and I gave him my business card. My phone rings about a week later. He’s like Amberly. And I see it’s a New York city area code. I’m like, Ooh, this is New York city. I better answer this. That’s awesome. Like hello? And I had told him if he was ever in LA, please let me know. I’d love to have him and his wife over to dinner. So he calls it’s him and I’m like, Hey Terry. I said, oh, I said, are you in town? I said, I I’d love to have you and your wife over for dinner. He said, no Amberly. I wanna read your manuscript. Like, he’s like, no, duh, I inviting him over for dinner. He’s like, no, I wanna read your manuscript. So I ended up sending it to him.
AL (00:39:15):
I got the book deal. They weren’t a huge publisher. So I know I knew I needed. Thankfully one of my clients was a, a really, she was an editor, a successful editor. And she said, Amber, you don’t have a great publisher. So you need a really good publicist to vet your book. So there’s two ways of doing it. You can self, I think you can self-publish and you can get your book out in a month. I mean, it’s quick. Get it on Amazon. If you’ve got a huge following on social media with a connected audience, and they’re just waiting for the day that you publish that book, self-publish, you know, you could hire, invest in a publicist and get connected who knows to major media, whether it’s TV show, big podcasts like AJS or you know, or you can do the traditional publishing as or hybrid.
AL (00:40:12):
I did hybrid publishing. And it takes longer. I mean, it took a year, but for me that was a good fit. I think we’re all different. And you have to go with, whatever’s a good fit for you for me, because I was so brand new. I, I had not built up my platform at all. And I had one goal. I had a year of the publishing process to when it was like they had the manuscript where it was edited, cover designed and all of that. And a year I thought, well, that was back when you know, you could do a swipe up. And I thought, well, I wanna build my audience on Instagram to like 10,000 so I can do a swipe up. So for one year I did not ask for anything. I provided value, value value, as much as I could. I gave, I created free playbooks workbooks, a free gratitude journal.
AL (00:41:08):
I was doing whatever, you know, a resilience challenge, a free webinar, seriously for free for a year. Then when it came time for my book to launch, I was like, I, I took my audience on that journey with me. Yeah. So it wasn’t like they didn’t see the behind the scenes of how freaked out I was or the struggle or whatever. Like they were with me when I opened my box of books for the first time my daughter videoed it and I wasn’t expecting, but I started crying when you’ve worked so hard on the book and you see it for the first time I cried and that’s on video. And so my audience was there with me. And to me it doesn’t feel like audience, to me, it feels like family. Like there are people that I literally connect with every single day. And you know, a lot of people didn’t understand why I was on social media.
AL (00:42:02):
They’re like, why are you on social media? Why is it so important? And I had this plan and my big vision was yes, I wanted to be able to swipe up. But I also, and I don’t know really how I thought this out or knew this, but I thought I wanted to build genuine relationships through social media because when it came time to planning my book tour, I wanted to be able to actually meet the people that I connected with in person. And that’s what happened. And it wasn’t until my husband saw that and he saw somebody, I was at the LA conference center and this girl comes running across the conference center with her suitcase, her roll on her carry-on suitcase. And she’s got tears coming down her face. She had read my book. She flew from Australia to come me at this conference. And that was the first time that my husband was like, wow, I guess that whole connecting through social media actually works. And I’m like, yeah, I’ve built some amazing relationships. So that’s when he kind of got it.
AJV (00:43:10):
But you know what you said there, and you’ve said this a couple of times that I, I think this is like a really good point to like bring up is, I mean, you’ve said earlier, it’s like ask who you can serve. Then you said, when that gentleman said, who does your marketing? You said, no, I just, you need to listen to your audience. And then you just said, my audience is more like family. I connect with them every day. So much of everything that you talk about is about the who. And so, you know, as, as we’re kind of rounding up here and I’m, I’m sensitive to the time, but how did you find your audience? Like how did you know? Cause I think that’s something people really struggle with. And quite honestly, I think people ultimately focus on the, what should I be doing and how do I get more followers? And you know, how do I do this versus going, who do I wanna serve? Who is the ideal audience for my message? Who should I be reaching? And so one, how did you figure out the who for you? And then how would you say other people can do that?
AL (00:44:12):
Well, I think that’s such a great question. And for me, I started just, I think that it’s really important to stay true to who you are and not try to be like somebody else that you might see on social media or, or, you know, your neighbor next door, whoever you have to be true to you. And I started just sharing like really, like, I don’t have a lot of things planned out. Like I share what’s actually going on with me, what I’m working through. I, I share the struggles along the way and how I got through it. So maybe it’ll help somebody else. And so on social media, I, I mean, I’ve shared things that my husband’s like, oh my God, like actually when I wrote my book and he read the back of the jacket, he said, oh my God, they wrote on here survivor of sexual abuse. Did you see that? And I’m like, yeah, I write about sexual overcoming sexual abuse in the book. You might wanna read it. Like, sorry I talk about it. So I talk about things and again, sharing from a scar,
AJV (00:45:22):
Read the book, read the book. Yeah. Yeah.
AL (00:45:25):
But you know, sharing from a scar and not an open wound. Yeah. But I think sharing what you know mm.
AJV (00:45:34):
I think that that’s worth just pausing and let people soak in, share what, you know, anyone who suffers from imposter syndrome, in my opinion, is sharing from a place of where they don’t feel like they know anything. And they feel like you feel like you’re an imposter, cuz you’re sharing from a place that’s not authentic to you. And it’s like share what, you know,
AL (00:45:57):
You always go back to your truth. Yeah. If you feel stuck, always go back to your truth. And I mean, that’s something actually my friend when I was, I was feeling like I got this big speaking gig and my friend Henry Amar, I was like, oh man, Henry, do you ever get nervous? And he is like, he goes, yes. You know, but you know what? The best advice I could give you is always go back to your truth. So if you’re ever stuck, you’re ever like, I don’t know what to say. Or even if you’re on stage speak, like always go back to your truth. You know the truth. I always heard that saying the truth will set you free. Well, it’s easy when you’re just honest, then you don’t have to overthink stuff cuz you’re just being you.
AJV (00:46:41):
Yeah. I love that. And it’s I yeah. And I think too, all of that, it’s like when you share what, you know, it’s like a part of that is you’re finding your audience, but they’re also finding you. Right. Mm-hmm but that’s when you share what you know, and you are authentic to yourself, I think there’s a part of that where you naturally start attracting people. We talk about this a lot. It’s be a magnet, not a megaphone, right? Yeah. And it’s like, or the more authentic you can be, you, you know, it’s like, it’s sometimes it’s good to be a little polarizing. Right. It’s like you attract the right people and you repel the wrong ones at at least the wrong ones for you. Right. Mm-hmm
AL (00:47:25):
I was gonna say, yeah, you don’t have to be everybody’s cup of tea, you know, which is kinda hard for, you know, I’m an overcoming people pleaser and I just want, oh, I want everybody to be happy. Well, you, you can’t do, you don’t have to be everybody’s cup of tea. You can be somebody’s, you know, I don’t know, shot of whiskey. I don’t know.
AJV (00:47:48):
But you know, that’s true. It’s I, I think that it, again, it’s like there’s an audience for anyone and anything, but it’s really hard to attract an authentic audience if you’re not being authentic and that’s really, and
AL (00:48:03):
I think you can feel that with, I know I can’t like you can sense when something’s not quite right.
AJV (00:48:09):
Yeah. I love that. So, so what would you say is like, what’s the one thing that you would suggest for someone to do? Who’s going all right. Well, how do I know who this audience is? Like I don’t, I don’t know. It’s like I, what I hear from people all the time is, well it’s everybody, my message pertains to everybody.
AL (00:48:28):
No, you know what I think I focus on, like for, I would say, and I mean, I’m no expert in this, but what I did to really start attracting, you know, my people, my friends is I focus. I’m not all over the place. You know, I focus on, you know, fitness mindset overcoming pain being a mom, like some things like things that other people relate to, maybe when you’re as big as somebody like, you know, Jay Shetty or Mel Robbins, that you can talk about everything under the sun. And I think that’s what a lot of people look to is people that already have millions of followers and yeah, they’ve been doing it for a long time. Yeah. And they have big teams and they may be able to talk about more things. And, but I think that when you get known for one thing, then you can kind open it out and focus on other things. But I think it’s really important to be known for one thing and start getting some traction there that’s at least what I did anyway. I was like, I started getting known for being that girl who you know, was the grit girl. I, then I started paying attention. People were hashing me, resilience queen and grit girl and stuff like that. And I’m like, oh, resilience queen. I kinda like that. You know, grit girl
AJV (00:49:59):
AL (00:50:01):
I’ll I’ll take it. You know? And I started paying attention to like what, what people were were saying in meantime, I’m just focusing on sharing what I know, not going too off topic, like sticking to what my truth is being completely authentic. Sometimes my husband’s like, you are way, you’re say like, you’re saying way too much. Like really do you have to share all of that? But
AJV (00:51:25):
Not your audience.
AL (00:51:27):
They were not, I was not their cup of tea.
AJV (00:51:30):
AL (00:51:54):
Mm-Hmm
AJV (00:52:07):
But it’s a sign of being truly authentic. And I think there’s, I think we all need a little bit more of that. I bet one of the biggest conversations that I have with people who who have been really successful in business, but don’t have really big followings and now they really wanna transition into doing something more about sharing a message. They’re like, wow, just, I wanna make sure that, you know, I don’t rub anyone the wrong way. And I’m like, well then you’re not gonna be able to tell 95% of your story. Mm-Hmm
AL (00:52:51):
Mm-Hmm
AJV (00:52:56):
Alright. Well, okay. So I know that we’re a little bit over, but I have just two, two quick, last things. And before we wrap up, I wanna make sure everyone knows how to connect with you. So for everyone listening, if you love this conversation, I would just highly, highly encourage you guys. You need to get the true grit, grace book. You guys need to check out this podcast. Amber Lee just launched a mastermind called the unstoppable life mastermind. You can find all of those things plus all of her, you know, online platforms that she’s a part [email protected]. Right? So Amber Lee lago.com. I’ll put that in the show notes, we’ll put links for the book. We’ll put links for all the things you can just access ’em really quickly. But just to wrap this up, and this has nothing to do with like a conversation in general, but I just love to ask people just some questions for one to help us get to know you. But also I just find if these things are helpful to me then most definitely they’re gonna be helpful to someone else. So three quick questions, right? And these, I
AL (00:53:55):
Love it
AJV (00:53:56):
As shorter, as long as you want, what’s one book that you would recommend universally to any human on the planet,
AL (00:54:04):
The four agreements,
AJV (00:54:06):
The four agreements. Love it. Okay.
AL (00:54:09):
That’s a great gift book too. It’s just, yeah. Simple. Good. Yeah.
AJV (00:54:14):
Okay. Then my next question would be, if there was one lesson that you have learned since really building your personal brand, being an author, podcaster speaker, you know, all the things, what’s the one lesson that you hold closest to your heart.
AL (00:54:34):
Mm. I would say to, to really listen to your gut I know that’s probably so weird and you’ve probably not had anybody say that before, like, but to listen to your gut, because I think, you know, as my brand kind of grew a lot of distractions come along with that and a lot of amazing opportunities come sometimes and some that are not so amazing, some that they really want to use your brand to build their audience, which is, which is normal, you know, like that, that happens. And there’s one thing that I did like early on that I started getting some traction and, you know, getting some followers and I had this, this brand of like teeth whitening thing that they sent me the teeth whitening and they wanted me to advertise it on my Instagram. And I was like, oh, never done that, but send me the kit and I’ll try it.
AL (00:55:33):
If it works, you know, I’ll share about it. And it wasn’t something that I did a lot and I wasn’t known for like promoting things ever. Like I don’t, I was not known. I mean, it took a year for me to promote my book. Like I was just, not that I wasn’t like that typical like person that was just like, buy this, buy that that’s just not me. And so I advertised the teeth whitening, but I tried to play it all into like, you know, how important smile is? I don’t know, blah, blah, blah. I lost so many followers that day. Like people were just like, oh God really she’s gonna do that. Now she’s getting paid to, so that was a very valuable lesson to me because now even like with my podcast, I committed to like going all in for like, gosh, almost two years with no advertisements.
AL (00:56:30):
I was like, I just, I’m gonna add value. So people start to listen and they know I’m serious about showing up and giving ’em value. And I just had somebody reach out for a sponsorship and I was like you know, I have to try this and I have to really love the products. And if I really love it, then we’ll talk about a sponsorship. Well, I really love the product, but I’m still kind of like, I did the advertisement and I genuinely love the products, but is that the route I want to go? So I think it’s important to listen to your gut and know that you
AJV (00:57:07):
Can know your audience,
AL (00:57:08):
Know your audience. Yeah. And, and how important it is to like stick to, you know, like your brand and your audience and not be distracted by some shiny object, or this would be good. It’s like it’s for the long haul, like think of it for the long haul. And so that’s what I think about is like, listen to my gut and think of it for the long
AJV (00:57:31):
Haul. Yeah. It’s like, don’t get distracted by the shiny things that you can take you off the path. That’s good. Love that last one. Amber, do you want to be known for,
AL (00:57:47):
I want to be known really as someone who is I, this, the first thing that came to mind is like you know, compassionate and a connector. I love connecting people. I think that sometimes we don’t kind of know sometimes that we have a gift at doing something until it keeps showing up in our life. And for some reason I love connecting people. Like I have an eye for going, oh my gosh, you would be awesome meeting this person. And so I’ve whether it’s, you know, a group of sober sisters or a group of badass, you know, female entrepreneurs, that’s one of the reasons I started my mastermind is cuz I love connecting people. And I think that when we connect with one another, that’s how we both, we all grow, you know, when we do things to together. And so I believe in abundance and there’s so much for us to, to have, you know, such a life of success and that we can all thrive. And so I guess I would like to be known as the kind connector how’s that
AJV (00:59:03):
Take it. I love it. Oh my gosh. Thank you so much for being on the show. This has been such a delight. There’s so many nuggets. Like I literally wrote down like 10 different like one liners and just little nuggets.
AL (00:59:18):
This is okay. I have to ask you a quick question. Just a quick question. When I talk to you, like y’all I love talking to AJ, but when I see you online, it’s like your eyes are these piercing. Like it’s so much fun to look at you online. Are you looking at the, this is a branding question, like an event question. Are you looking through the camera or are you looking in the screen
AJV (00:59:42):
At the camera?
AL (00:59:45):
AJV (00:59:53):
Gonna take,
AL (00:59:54):
I’m gonna take a sticky note and I’m gonna put it on my computer that I need to okay. See the difference.
AJV (01:00:00):
How are you? And I do, and this is a little tip for anyone who’s does a lot of camera where it’s like, it can be really annoying sometimes to look at this little dot when I see like your face, like kind of off to the side. So I make your picture really small and I put it right underneath the camera.
AL (01:00:15):
Oh.
AJV (01:00:16):
And so it’s like, I’m I can always see you and your facial expressions right below. And so, although I’m, it’s so good exactly. At the camera. You’re right in my peripheral. So I can see your facial expressions. I can see you move. But that’s always really important to me because I wanna make sure that I’m making eye contact with whoever’s be block’s
AL (01:00:38):
So good. Okay. I’m looking at you now. And I have to say you were incredible when you came to speak at, at the mastermind, people are still talking about all you shared. That was the best presentation by far I’ve ever had in the mastermind. You’re slides, everything. You’re just such a pro and I’m so grateful for you and even doing this podcast interview, I’m like, okay, Ambery I’m doing a virtual event tonight. And thank goodness we did this interview cuz I’m looking at the camera now
AJV (01:01:13):
So I love that. Cause that’s cause it’s a really important thing. It’s like I noticed too when other people it’s like, I know that they’re not looking at me. And when you know, I watch videos, I wanted to feel like you’re looking at me.
AL (01:01:24):
Yeah, yeah. I
AJV (01:01:25):
Have that connection. But it’s it can be really distracting. And I was also like, why does she look so good? Why is her hair and makeup so good today? So you’re doing a virtual event tonight. It’s like part of it is like, I can’t look at myself cause I’m like, oh God, like she looks like she’s all like dressed up. You look. So you look so good. Thank you.
AL (01:01:42):
I have on my workout pants on the bottom.
AJV (01:01:45):
AL (01:01:56):
It’s so sweet. Oh my
AJV (01:01:57):
Gosh. We love you. We are such a fan of you and y’all if this is your first introduction to Amber Lee Lago, y’all need to go follow her. Subscribe to this podcast again. Amber Lee lago.com. Check her out, check out the book. It is just it’s nonstop. Awesome. So we’re so grateful for you on this show. Thank you so much. And for everyone listening, we love you. We’ll catch you next time on the influential personal brand. We’ll see you later.