Ep 538: Play a Bigger Game with Markus Kaulius
RV (00:01):
I have an exciting announcement to make the man you’re about to meet. Marcus Kaulius is not only a friend not only a brand builders group client, but today, this morning we found out that his book Play A Bigger Game is officially a USA Today national bestselling book. We just found out early this morning and we met Marcus a year ago, I dunno, over a year ago. We’re gonna talk about that here. And we had no idea when we scheduled this interview that we would, we would do the interview on the day that we would find out that the, the vision and the dream that he once had when he became a client would actually come true on the same day. So let me tell you the rest of his story a little bit, or tell you his bio, and then you’ll get to meet him.
RV (00:54):
So he’s a serial entrepreneur, and one of the things I love about Marcus is he has built multiple eight and nine figure businesses. So he’s a real entrepreneur. He has a supplement company that he took from startup to $170 million, which I want to know about. That is so impressive and inspiring to me. He helped people worldwide lu like lose, like a cu a cumulative 3 million pounds, which is really cool. He’s been featured in Fox News on Apple tv, CNN. He’s a Guinness World Record book holder. He’s got several hundred thousand people who follow him online. And then as of today, he’s Canadian, who is a USA today national bestselling author. So, Marcus, congratulations brother. We’re so excited to celebrate with you. Welcome to the show, man.
MK (01:52):
Oh, Rory, this what an intro. Thank you. Thank you for this opportunity. Thank you for everything you and brand builders are doing, man, it is awesome. You already know how much I love you guys. And now to put me on that list, it’s just crazy. It is absolutely surreal. If anybody is watching this podcast, listening to this podcast, and I seem a little nuts at times, just know I’m riding a bit of a high
RV (02:24):
Yeah. So, so when did you is this apropos the timing of this? So when did you first hear, hear about Brand Builders Group and, you know, you started this journey of like, building the personal brand and then the book, and then meet us, and then like, here, here we are, like, you know, hitting, hitting a, a really great high highlight moment in your career. So like, tell me the story of how you found us and all, all of that.
MK (02:50):
I I remembered this story this morning ’cause I think I’ve only given you glimpses of it, but what a god led moment. I was writing my book, and I am not somebody, by the way, as people get to know me, you’re gonna find out, like I, I’m not a guy who’s like, oh, I’ve always wanted to write a book. I, I felt called to write this book and God just really wrote through through me. And he put this book together. And as I’m getting towards the end, I start going, oh God. Like I don’t, I don’t know any publishers. I don’t know any agents. I know nothing about, nothing over here. Mm. I was going into deep prayer. I’m like, Lord, I need you to step in. Like you told me to write this, but I don’t know what to do with it. Like, you just want me to pick up the phone a hundred times.
MK (03:30):
I’ll, I’ll do it. You know, I will. That day, that day that I was deep in that prayer, a Christian buddy of mine who we don’t even con connect that often, he reaches out and he goes, Hey, do you know who Rory Vaden is? And I, I think you’re writing your book right now. You need to meet Rory Christian Guy and just, he gives you, gives me this resume. And I’m like, are you serious right now? And I’m looking up like, God, you are awesome. And boom, texts go back and forth. You and I are connected that day and you sent me this beautiful text, and then you sent me the links to, to podcast, and you’ve been on with Ed, my lead and Louis House, and I’m watching these. And by the way, Rory, those were works of art. They were stunning. Like every, like, you could have scripted it better for how those went.
MK (04:23):
And I was like, it, you know, you know, any good God-given moment where it’s just like my screen was lit up in a special way. I’m like, oh, this is the guy. This is the guy who I am supposed to work with. And from day one, I’ve just, I loved who you’ve put together. You have an amazing team. I love you and aj, I love the, I love your marriage. I love the way you guys treat each other, the way you talk about each other. And then of course, I love how niche you guys are. You guys have figured out this system in this lane, and you stick to your lane and you guys kill it in your lane. And I think I’m a great example of that because again, people listening, I am not some like of course I got a bestselling book, of course,
RV (05:29):
Saying, when was that? When, when was it like a, it was like a y was it like a year ago? That was we first, it was like a year ago. Right? Man, I love how God moves like that and just go like, you know, and also it’s, it’s such a, it’s such an example of a story where it’s like God will show you the second step after you take the first step. And it’s like, you go, Hey, I feel prompted to write this book, but I don’t know what to do with it. But it’s like, well write the book and then I’ll show you, right? Like, write the book and then I’ll open the door. And I think that’s a really big part of how God moves, is like, I’ll, I’ll, I’ll show you the second step. You know, I think about like, the story of Moses, right? And, and, and God never said, you know, here’s what’s gonna, here’s how you’re gonna move through the desert. He just said, go tell Farrah to let my people go. Like, doesn’t explain how, doesn’t explain like what’s gonna happen. Just like, go do this. So I love that. The, the other thing, brother,
MK (06:27):
Definitely lemme jump in real quick because I love what you just said and I so agree with you. But I also see this is one of the biggest issues with humanity today. We go, okay, I know this first step I’m supposed to take, whether God gave it to me or not. I know I’m supposed to do this, but I’m not gonna move until I know the next 10 steps. And I think that’s what just freezes people. And that’s why so many people get so stuck where they are. They’re like, well, I know I should do this, but I wanna know exactly what’s coming. I think the most successful people and the people who get really good results in life, and, and this is a great example of it today, is I knew only the first step in front of me, and God only lit up this one step.
MK (07:10):
And I said, okay, I’ll do it. I don’t need to know what’s next. I have enough faith and have enough trust. And again, you don’t have to have God for this part, although it’s really good if you do
RV (07:54):
Totally different outcome. Yeah, I mean that such a great example. So I wanna hear about the company because you know, I, I, I mean we love personal brands, clearly this is what we do. But I but also are entrepreneurs and you know, we, we think of like real entrepreneurs as like people who like built a widget, a a a a product or system that’s not like based on them as a, as an individual. And you’ve done that. And I wanna hear, was that a similar kind of thing? Was it like, oh my gosh, I have no idea what’s gonna happen. I’ll just take the first step and then see what happens after that? And then, and then did you guys grow all the way to $170 million a year in revenue?
MK (08:34):
Well, I, I won’t get too deep into, okay, let’s, let’s jump right in, let’s start with this. Yes. It was another situation of, I know the first step, and it was January 17th, 2005. God spoke to me and said, I want you to have your own bread. I was already selling supplements. I had three supplement stores at the time, and we can rewind further. And I went from tiny business to a little bit bigger and a little bit bigger. And then it was this moment and God said, I want you to have your own brand. And of course, I don’t know, holy smokes, I probably didn’t know 1% of 1% of 1% of what I needed to know, but I knew enough to take the first step and I started to create my own supplements. And as a Christian man who had really devoted his life to God saying, God, I won’t make decisions without you.
MK (09:22):
I won’t make moves without you because I don’t wanna do that ever again. And I know the piece that comes with having God on your team. I mean, that’s the best business partner there is. And we just made little steps, little steps. I, I’m not the Instagram business that oh my goodness, I was doing a million after two weeks. And if you’re not doing it this way, you’re doing it wrong. Oh my goodness, man. I was, I was eating craft dinner for years into this, and my wife and I loved talking about this. You know, the first five years at Magnum, five years, I didn’t take a salary. Mm. I just knew we were doing well. Like by the fifth year we were, we were in the millions, but I knew where I wanted it to go and where God had shown me where it was gonna go.
MK (10:07):
And I knew that if I started pulling money too early, if I started driving a Ferrari or a Range Rover too early, it was all gonna crash down. So I just kept moving in faith and taking those steps forward. And he kept opening doors. And last year we were in over a hundred countries worldwide. Wow. I’ve learned so much over the almost 20 years that I ran that business. And then God called me one day and said, now I want you to sell it. And then he sold it
RV (11:20):
That’s really cool, man. Can you just, like, that road I think is so important for entrepreneurs to know because it’s like, you know, you see someone, you see all the people with the Ferraris and the private jets or whatever. I think it’s like entrepreneurship is so glamorized today. And it’s just like, the reality though is like, it is a massive grind for at least like five years. And then I think you feel like you’re failing if you’re not like, you know, living this up. And it’s like, that’s not the story. I mean, that’s how it ends maybe for a very small few. So how, like, how many years did it take you to get to seven figures and then to eight figures, and then to nine figures? Like, just, just roughly like, do you kind of remember what the arc, because you said it was like 20 years between when you started it and you sold it, so we know it, like basically went from like zero to one 70 in 20 years, right?
MK (12:22):
Yep. I grew anywhere from 22% to 56% per year, year over year. Okay. And you know, the funny stuff that, like you talked about, all we see is the stuff on social media, the, the stuff that’s never talked about. Do you know what was the most uncomfortable year, the 56% growth? It was nuts. Like the amount, and we were in inventory business. So it’s so different for someone who doesn’t carry inventory. But when you’re an inventory business, 56% growth means I had to have like, almost double the inventory. It was nuts. But here’s one of the other things I wanna say about something you just said. And I, and I love that you’re bringing this up. I think there’s so many people, especially when we see social media and we’re trying to copy what we think we’re seeing. Mm-Hmm.
MK (13:13):
And we get so tied to the outcome. And this is such a dangerous thing for entrepreneurs who are, who are watching this stuff and going, well, I’m not gonna be successful until I’m driving the Ferrari. I’m on the private jet, I’m this and this and this. So I’d love to give just a little bit of the other side of this coin. Number one, if you get too tied to the outcome and you think that that success, I wanna also mention to you, everyone who I’ve ever met who achieved that stuff, everyone I’ve met was grossly unfulfilled. Mm. Like horrendously like some of the most unhappy people, especially backed with the fact that I’m supposed to be living my dream. I thought this was my dream. If, if this isn’t my dream, what what is life all about? And that what a horrifying reality. So my encouragement to everybody who is an entrepreneur is enjoy the journey, find ways to enjoy the journey. Don’t just tie it to a end result. Enjoy the journey, because it is likely gonna take you way longer than you think it will. Yes. Social media goes, yeah. If you’re not super successful in three years, you’ve blown it. I don’t know if I’ve actually met a human being, and I’ve met a lot of very successful people who became radically successful in three years.
RV (14:33):
Yeah. And I, I would echo that. I mean, when you say grossly unfulfilling my friend network of people who have sold companies, many of them are not just unfulfilled. They go into a stark depression. It’s, it’s, it, it’s like you’ve spent your whole life working, you achieve this thing, the high lasts, you know, a few weeks. And then it’s like, wait, this is supposed to be the pinnacle. And, and, and what is it? And that’s a really, it’s it, it’s hard to explain, right? Because, because
RV (15:28):
So enjoying the journey, I think is is, is a really big part. And the, the other, the other thing about that enjoying the journey is like, you know, there, I think there’s a, there’s an element of truth to the hustle and the grind. Like, I don’t know someone who’s built a successful company that didn’t have some level of sacrifice, you know, for a season. But I think it’s also risky to say, man, I’m gonna do nothing for 10, or, you know, for 20 years of my life other than work. Because you go at the end, even if it does pay off, and a lot of times it doesn’t, you know, have the huge payday. But even if it does, you look back and you go, well, that wasn’t worth losing 20 years of like seeing my kids or seeing the world or like getting in shape, like losing my fit and my health or whatever. So that’s, that’s awesome to have your in insight on that.
MK (16:21):
Oh, thank you brother. And you know what, you’re so right. And I, I work with a lot of guys these days who’ve had exits, and you’re absolutely right, man, the amount of depression and just loss of identity, because we tie our identity up so much in our, in our business. Like yeah, Marcus was the Magnum guy. I was so blessed because I was called to leave it. I was called to sell it. So I didn’t have to struggle with that piece. But man, did I have my eyes open going, oh yeah, this was a moment, this moment right here. Like, I’ll never forget having to pack up my nice big, beautiful office. I mean, I had this thing designed for me. It had all the beauty, all the, the, the beautiful desk and the this and that. I had a slide that left my office and went into, it was a secret slide against a secret wall. It was so cool. I had to pack it up one day to give it to the new owner, and I had to move into the tiny office next door. And I’m sitting there going, this is a moment, this is a moment where most men or women who sell the business are gonna go, what have I done?
RV (17:23):
What have I
MK (17:24):
Done? Can’t go in the small office. I’m not the small office guy. I’m the big office guy.
MK (18:08):
Like, if you’re punching a clock for 40 years, it’s like anything but punching the clock. And I’ll be happy. And I see that. But for an entrepreneur who, who actually puts their heart and soul into something and uses their mind and their energy every single day, and then to go from that to just like, okay, I’m gonna swing a club for a few hours every day. Oh man, that, that, it’s, it’s not what you think It’s Mm-Hmm. So again, enjoying the journey will help you realize what you’re really all about. And you’ll develop relationships, you’ll keep growing. And I think growth is a huge part of enjoying your journey.
RV (18:44):
Yeah. I want to talk to you, I want to talk to you about that. ’cause That’s another thing that just year after year after year, this amazes me. You know, when, when I first heard about personal development and going to conferences and seminars and getting coaching, I remember so many people going, that’s such a waste of time. Those are people taking advantage of weak people who are desperate, who, you know, just, you know, they’re needy people. And like, but yet I, yet I would read a book and I was like, that’s not at all what this is. This is amazing. This is, and, and now I become more and more convicted that it’s like every time, it’s not this the desperate needy people who are at the con personal development conferences and in the coaching programs, it’s the people like you. It’s the, it’s the go-getters.
RV (19:33):
It’s, it’s the world changers. It’s the, the mission-driven messengers. It’s the’s the people that you go, like, of all the people you wouldn’t think would, hi, join Brand Builders group and say, I’m, I just sold a company for a, you know, a $170 million company and now I’m gonna go pay somebody else to be in their coaching program. And yet it’s always that way. It’s like, and, and I know you were in Tony, you were in Tony Robbins platinum thing. So te tell me a little bit about your philosophy on growth and personal development, because it’s like, you seem to very much be a product of that, of, and someone who’s really bought into that, you know, for, for not just brand builders group, but lots of, lots of people.
MK (20:17):
Yeah. Oh, thank you. I love where you’re leading this, by the way. So my life is one of these timelines where it’s all about the personal growth. I also, like you grew up really poor. And the first 15 years of my life, I was so stuck in that mindset and like, I’m not gonna make anything. I can’t because of where I come from, because of what I’ve already experienced. I no chance for me. Hmm. I’m so blessed. I got Tony Robbins cassette tapes when I was 15 years old, and there was just something about the way that guy spoke. It might be his Tony Robbins big voice
MK (21:08):
I’m in control. You’re taking control of your life. And if you do it for a long enough time, you are gonna recognize that everything in your life changed. And when you talk about these conferences, you talk about being in these rooms and who are in these rooms at the very basic, just think about if you surround yourself with a whole bunch of go-getters who are doing big things, who have already achieved big things, of course that’s gonna have a massive impact on you. It’s going to change how you view success, what you think you are capable of. And you listen to these stories and you, you talk with guys like Rory and you’re like, wait, you grew up poor. I thought because I grew up poor, I couldn’t do anything. And it’s like, who told you that? Those are limiting beliefs. And soon you just break down these limiting beliefs.
MK (21:55):
And it’s amazing how many we have. It’s amazing how many things we set in stone in our minds. Totally. When we were 6, 7, 8 years old. And when you peel them back, it’s like, oh my goodness, that that’s not even remotely true. But my 7-year-old self who’s still in there, said, no, no, no, no. Hey, hey, you can’t do that ’cause of this man. It is wild. And then essentially you’re taking control of your life. You have the reigns of your life. Isn’t that exciting? And by the way, any Christians listening to this, because I know there’s a lot of Christians listening to this. Remember, you have God inside you. You are a co-creator of your life. You are co-author of your life. God did not create you with all the blessings He’s given you all the talents he’s given you to live some crappy life on the couch. If you do, he has mercy for you. I have mercy for you. He still loves you. It’s not about that. But he’s going, what do you wanna do? You could do anything.
RV (22:51):
Yeah. That’s, that’s, that’s an inspiring thought. And I think it’s, it’s easy to lose sight of that as Christians was just like, literally the Holy Spirit dwells in us going the creator of the universe and all of its magnitude and power is like inside of you to do exactly that. It’s, it’s very easy to overlook that. It’s very easy to take that for granted and, you know, and to underestimate what’s possible. Like, it’s so easy to underestimate what’s possible. You know, I, I’ve been talking a lot to our team at BBG, right? So we, we had eight figures last year was our fifth year in the business. And it’s like,
MK (23:36):
Congratulations brother.
RV (23:38):
Thank you, thank you. But like, when AJ and I started BBG coming out of the former company, our vision was 1000 messengers. We’re like, one day we’re gonna get to a thousand messengers, a thousand personal brands that we’re, we’re, we’re, we know in a meaningful way we’re serving in like an in, you know, in an in intimate relationship. And we thought, well, gosh, if you, if we had a thousand people at a thousand dollars a month, that’d be 1.2 million a month that that’d be a figure business. That was like our, that was like our 30 year, you know, like in my mind I’m like, oh, that’s like our 20 year, 30 year vision. And it’s like, God made it happen in five years. And now you go, whoa. Like if, if we could go from zero to that in five years, what could we do between year five and 10 or five and 20?
RV (24:26):
And it’s like, I don’t even wanna put a re it’s like, I almost even wanna put a goal around it because I’m like, man, the, if, if you apply that same or just the same order of magnitude to what happened, go like, like God can multiply. I mean, he’s a, he’s a multiplier. Like, it, it’s not, it’s not hard for him to multiply things. He just needs a willing vessel who wants to participate and co-create in it, and then go like, look what I will do through you as, as long as you’re willing to invite me in, and as long as you’re willing to like, share, share in the credit with me. Like, you know, I just go, it’s, it’s, it’s so magnificent. Easy to, easy to overlook.
MK (25:14):
Oh, so good. And Rory, by the way, I so see this in you and aj and that’s one of the reasons I’m so drawn to you guys. And I love you guys. I love what you’re doing and I’m so excited to watch what happens for the next five to 10 years. And, you know, I’m gonna be on that, on that sideline cheering you guys on and on the bench whenever you want to call me in, I’ll be going in. But I think one of the key things that I wanna bring up here is this is where a lot of entrepreneurs mess up is, and even Christian entrepreneurs. Mm. You get to a certain level of success and maybe it’s a level of success that you’re like, I don’t know how I got here. I’m shocked. But then we start going, well, you know, I am pretty awesome and you know, I do deserve this, this, this, and this, and what happens?
MK (25:58):
And you just said it, which I love how you said it. Even if you just applied the same principles, the same standards, and just kept doing the same thing, you’ll grow incredible. But we don’t even do that. We take our foot off the gas, we stop doing all the things that made us successful. And like you said, and I totally agree with you, you stop involving God, you stop going. Well, let me tell you why. I’m like, that’s why I’m here. That’s the only reason I have this book. That’s the only reason anything you call success in my life is a hundred percent him. If you see anything negative or embarrassing, oh, that’s Marcos, I, I’ll take credit for that stuff.
RV (26:34):
MK (26:35):
Everything else is him. So if I remove him from the equation, all I have left is the embarrassment, and I am am confident, I’ll go to zero pretty quick. And I’ll be like, how did that happen? Oh, I’ll tell you exactly how. So that’s my encouragement to any entrepreneur who reaches any level of success. It’s, there’s not a specific number because it has to do with what you believe That number is where you are shocked that you got there. It could be 1 million, it could be 10 million, it could be a hundred million. And then you just go, I made it. It’s over. I did this. This is incredible. I don’t need to even do whatever I was doing. And everything starts to change for the negative.
RV (27:13):
Mm-Hmm,
RV (27:53):
I need to learn, I need to study, I need to optimize. I need to use data. I need to build a team, whether it’s for me or God. It’s like in order for it to, to to be good, like I have to do the same activities either way. And then I, I guess I just, I felt like God saying to me, the only way you know is, is to wake up every day and to dedicate it to me and to wake up every day and to just keep giving it to me. And is, it really is a matter of an intention of just being like, okay, this is yours. Because the, it’s, the behaviors are the same. The intentions are what’s different. And hopefully that never changes. And I, I do, I I think it, it can change that. And that’s why I think, frankly, there’s so much conversation in the Bible about money and the, the risks of money and the danger of money.
RV (28:40):
It’s not that rich people are evil. It’s that rich people can reach a point where they start to become less dependent on God because their worldly needs are met. And that is what opens the door for evil to kind of like come into their life. You know, David was very wealthy. Solomon was very wealthy. Jeremiah was very wealthy. Like there’s a lot of very wealthy people in, in, in, in scripture. But it’s, it’s never a, it, it’s, it’s never a self-reliance. It’s always a God reliance. So anyways, it’s, it’s powerful to, to, to to see that happen. So just real quick, so I know we’re wrapping up, but I wanna remind everybody. So the book is called Play A Bigger Game, which I love, right? You could see Marcus has been playing a bigger game. He’s got strategies for stepping into this. The book is seven principles, seven Universal Principles to Experience True Fulfillment, which is what we’re talking about and how to really, really win at life. First of all, all Marcus, where do you want people to go to, to get copies of the book if they wanna like read more about this and, and what you have to share?
MK (29:50):
They can go anywhere. Great books are sold. You know, go to Amazon, go to Barnes and Noble, go to any of those great places.
RV (29:56):
Don’t go to anywhere where crappy books are sold. That’s, you won’t find this one. If they sell crappy books,
MK (30:06):
And I, I wanna encourage you, everybody, if you’re gonna take, if you’re gonna grab a copy of my book and the Audible is coming out any day right now, which I was really excited to do because I love that stuff, but I want to tell you this, you must take action. Don’t just read the book. And one of the great things I love about what God gave me to put in this book, constant challenges and advanced challenges, because you have to put the book down and actually do something with it. We can consume every book on the planet, and if we do nothing with it, nothing will change. But if you take action, you can actually start to see your life change right away. It’s just perspective shifts. You just look at things differently. And so that’s what my book is all about. And I would love to hear, if you read my book, if you listen to the audio book, will you reach out to me? Tell me what was your takeaway? I would love to hear that. I will personally respond because I love hearing that from people. It’s my favorite thing to get messages from people I do not know from wherever in the world. And they’re telling me they read their book, and this was the impact that made that would light me up.
RV (31:12):
Yeah, man, I, I love it. And I love seeing a, a Christian entrepreneur that’s had the level of success that you’ve had who has not at all lost their reliance on God, but only leaned more into God. That, that’s inspiring to me and something I think worth aspiring to. And also, I mean, you’re still growing and still doing personal development and still like, I mean I, I, I just, I love your zest for life and your zest for the Lord and and your zest for service. And I think that really comes through in this book and, and the movement and all the things you are. So we’re so proud to, you know, be a small part of your success story and this book and everything that’s going on, and you represent very much the things that we want to be associated with.
RV (32:03):
And I think, you know, so many times people hear Brand Builders Group and they think, oh, Louis Howes and Eric Thomas and, and, and Ed Mylet and Amy Porterfield and all these amazing people, which is great. We love them too, but it’s, it’s like, I, I think people maybe don’t realize how much there’s a whole monster future generation of, of inspirers and thought leaders and messengers who are like literally rising up and you’re in that group. And we’re so honored to be a part of that brother. So keep it going, keep serving and we wish you all the best.
MK (32:40):
Rory, thank you for everything you’re doing. Thank you for the beautiful company you guys are running and for being so obedient the way you are. I love you guys, and God bless you, man.
RV (32:50):
God bless you, brother.